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08 Draft Then/Now

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by ThunderHorse17, May 12, 2011.

  1. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Re-grading the 2008 draft: Wrong about 'Skins, right about Chiefs - NFL - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

    San Diego Chargers

    The Chargers had five picks, and only two are left with the team. Corner Antoine Cason, the team's first-round pick, started 15 games last season and is a quality corner. They hit on that one. Third-rounder Jacob Hester has started at fullback and can also fill in as a running back. The Chargers traded a second-round pick to Miami to get receiver Chris Chambers, a move that didn't produce much. Chambers was released last year. The Chargers didn't get much from this draft.

    Grade now: C-
    Grade then: C

    For all the Hate I see/hear for the 07 draft, IMO this draft was much lower yielding.

    I kno 3 players of the 07 draft remain on the team, 3 of my favorite SD players. Legs and Siler were Draft Value gold. And in a draft where we only had 3 holes if that to fill, the lost picks for Weddle would only have been our 5th and 7th picks to cuts. Which as weve seen wuold only have pushed Legs and Siler up the draft board.
  2. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    07 key losses:

    ILB Donnie Edwards *KC
    ILB Randal Godfrey *FA
    SS Terrence Kiel *FA
    WR Keenan McCardell *FA

    SO we found a ILB a safety and a WR, granted Buster was supposed to be the WR and Waters was supposed to be the ILB. Both were too injury prone. Anybody over Kiel then imo was better, McCardell was gettin up there in years as was Godfrey and Donnie. None of theme were KEY contributors to our epic 06 season.

    EDIT:
    Oyea and all the backups were on the team ready to replace/compete for the spots. Wilhelm, Cooper, VJ, and the drafted CBD and Weddle.
  3. FCBolt
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    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    We got one solid starter out of that draft. The Hester fans like to call him a starter too, but we know that's bullsheet.
    Other than that, it was crap.

    C- is being kind. You can't operate as a "we'll pick up low $ FA and otherwise build through the draft" team while executing drafts where all you get is a starting CB and a hybrid FB who's a decent STer. You need more starters than that coming out of each draft.

    I'd give it a solid D+
  4. Concudan
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    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Oh yeah! Well go follow someone else then!

    Oh wait....

    This isnt twitter....

    Never mind.
  5. AnteaterCharger
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    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Davis was a disaster from the get go, no one saw him being selected that early and it probably had something to do with trading up so much to acquire Weddle then in the next round. If we kept that extra third, used a second or third on Davis and the first on weddle I think this draft would've been more tolerable
  6. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Yea my point was more that this draft sucked more than the 07 draft. And ppl think we were reaching in 07 by wasting picks to go get Weddle.

    One starter, at least we can thank AJ that it was a 1st rounder this time. And yea Hester is jus a good backup/situational guy to have around.
  7. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    I would also have to say FC that a D+ is still pretty sympathetic for the 08 draft.

    07 I would say... C-.....maybe a C.
  8. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    It really just shows us with AJ he isnt afraid to reach for a player he thinks will drop right into the system here. He sure keeps doin it year after year.
  9. DenverBolt67
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    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    If he thinks guys will "just drop right into the system", then why are they still using the excuse for English that "He had to learn a new position"?

    To me, it doesn't look like he grabs player that will fit the system. He just falls in love with players and doesn't care if they fit or not
  10. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    So has anyone looked at the other teams drafts?

    3 starters in this draft was a great draft for any team.

    Pittsburgh Steelers

    The Steelers had seven picks, and landed just one starter. That was top pick Rashard Mendenhall, the team's starting running back. The rest of the draft produced a lot of misses. Second-round receiver Limas Sweed was the biggest of the busts so far. He has seven catches in three seasons and didn't play in 2010 because of a torn Achilles' tendon. Third-round linebacker Bruce Davis, who looked perfect for the Pittsburgh scheme, also flopped and isn't with the team anymore. Fourth-round pick Tony Hills (tackle), fifth-round pick Dennis Dixon (quarterback) and sixth-round pick Ryan Mundy (safety) are all backups still on the roster.

    Grade now: C-
    Grade then: B

    Skins, Bucs, Seahucks, and the Steelers all had worse drafts than our 2 players.

    Philadelphia Eagles

    The Eagles didn't have a first-round pick, trading it to Carolina for a 2009 first-round pick and some other picks. That pick was traded in 2009 to the Bills for other picks. The Eagles did hit big in the second round of this draft by taking receiver DeSean Jackson. He is one of the game's best big-play receivers. The rest of the draft landed mostly backups. Second-round pick Trevor Laws, a defensive tackle from Notre Dame, has been a disappointment. Fourth-round pick Mike McGlynn started at center last year when Jamaal Jackson went down. Seventh-round pick King Dunlap also started at right tackle because of injuries.

    Grade now: C
    Grade then: B

    Desaun Jackson and that is it. And that gets a C? Anyone else notcing that this overall draft class was pretty crappy? 2 players is about a C grade in comparison.
  11. FCBolt
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    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    We got 1.5 starters out of it--not quite an F by any means.

    07 draft may have been a tad bit better. Obviously blew a wad too early on Davis, but Weddle (despite overpayment to move up) was a decent pick, and we got value from Naanee (5th) and Siler (7th) and Oliver (4th supplemented for 08 pick ). I guess you could call Oliver a 2008 instead (AJheads like to refer to him as both a 2007 and 2008 pick, just like they will with Butler haha).

    Hell, take Oliver out of the equation:
    Davis v Cason--2008 wins round 1
    Weddle v no one--2007
    Waters vs Hester--2008
    Chandler v no one--no winner
    Naanee v Thomas--2007
    No one vs Tribble--no winner
    Siler vs Clark--2007

    I got 2007 by a score of 3-2 and I'm not sure that the quality of the players would screw with that. Cason isn't that much better than Weddle. Siler vs Hester is a wash so far (though we'll see if Siler comes on if he gets over injuries). Naanee has had some decent input over the years. We might axe him, but he's made a few plays.

    2007 by a ch imho.
  12. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    New York Jets

    This is the Vernon Gholston draft. Ugh. He has been one of the biggest draft busts ever. The Jets picked him sixth overall and he hasn't done a thing. He's a big reason why the outside pass rush isn't very good. The rest of this draft didn't produce much either. Dustin Keller, the team's other first-round pick, is a big part of the offense at tight end, but the other five picks have had little impact. Fourth-round corner Dwight Lowery does see time in the nickel package and has started.

    Grade now: D-
    Grade then: C+

    New England Patriots

    The Patriots had seven picks. How many starters did great football mind Bill Belichick land? One. That's not good enough. They did hit on first-round pick Jerod Mayo, who has been a force as an inside linebacker. The rest of the draft produced backups and little else. Fourth-round corner Jonathan Willhite started one game last season. Fifth-round pick Matt Slater is also on the roster. There just aren't enough hits in this draft.

    Grade now: C-
    Grade then:B+

    LOL. The Great Football mind..
  13. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Jacksonville Jaguars

    Their draft has proven to be a disaster. They traded up in the first round to get Derrick Harvey, thinking he would be an elite pass rusher. He has six sacks in three seasons and is considered a bust. Ouch. Second-round pick Quentin Groves, another outside rusher, was traded to the Oakland Raiders and never lived up to expectations. There are no other players on the roster from this draft.

    Grade now: F
    Grade then: B-

    Damn the more up the list I go the more our 2 player draft looks pretty good.
  14. FCBolt
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    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    I don't think Casserly always has his head screwed on straight, but he has some interesting criteria he uses/used for himself to consider a GM successful:
    Round; % of GMs picks starting after 4 years
    1 75%
    2 50%
    3 30%
    4 25%
    5 25%
    6 10%
    7 10%
  15. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    Its the reality of most drafts, your lucky if you get 2 solid starters, and its a GREAT draft if you get 2 starters and a couple solid backups.

    Our 04' and 05' drafts, plus a couple of big UDFAs are whats still carrying us.
  16. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    That sounds about right for a good draft, but this draft those #s would have to be cut in half.
  17. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Seems to be so.

    SO who do you think had the worst draft? Browns, Skins, or the Jags.
    I would have to say Browns for all the picks they lost in addition to losing Quinn. Too bad too, I was all for a player who WANTED to QB in Cleveland. BUT it turns out he was just another Brownie Queen.

    1 Browns
    2 Jags
    3 Skins
  18. DenverBolt67
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    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    The problem is, when your team out right ignores free agency and exclusively uses the draft to build the team, you MUST do better than 2 starters per year. Now, most teams mix in a few free agents here and there, and doesn't even have to be the top name guys. But just do the math, it takes more than 2 starters per year from the draft to fill in the 2-4 most teams lose every year
  19. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    I've always felt draft picks are overvalued, both by teams and by fans.

    F*ck a 3rd round pick, I'll take Steve Smith tomorrow.
  20. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Well we do bring in the not so super FAs. We just dont do it until the season is on and a guy goes down that doesnt have a ready replacement on the roster. It is drafts like this that dont help the equation one bit. Kinda hard to hit on 4 guys unless you are the Chiefs and have 11 starter spots open for contention. I would say 3 starters is gold; 2 silver; 1 and 2+ backups bronze.
  21. wrbanwal
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    wrbanwal Bad A S S

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    I hate to go all B4L here but the one common thing about all of the above is average coach vs. great coach
  22. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    I can admit I am one. I love VALUE when it comes to the overal total hit on the team Sallary. What we get 2.5 years out of VJ for less than 4 mil? That is true value in a draft. Which imo is worth the risk of it never panning out like say bringing in a high dollar FA that is ready to go for the next 4-6 SB runs.

    Also Floyd and Legs have been playing for minimum and also have appeared very motivated to play and progress. VJ did the most good for Legs with his holdout. Which VJ off field dumbshits aside deserved to get paid before 09 season finished at least.
  23. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Not really 08 draft class sucked plain and simple.

  24. wrbanwal
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    wrbanwal Bad A S S

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    Bill Belichick is the GM?

    they still seem to make the playoffs year after year. I think you're proving my point. It's coaching
  25. DenverBolt67
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    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    Brining in a couple srub 4th tier free agents is a lot different than bringing in a couple 2nd teir free agents
  26. Savage Lizard
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    Savage Lizard Charger fan at 7000'

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    You're safe, unless you say the same thing several times each in a hundred different posts.
  27. DenverBolt67
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    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    Totally agree. You have to wonder how many of the draft picks would have done better in a different situation with a better coach.
  28. Savage Lizard
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    Savage Lizard Charger fan at 7000'

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    WHAT? You totally agree with an anti-Norv post? Who saw this coming?
  29. Savage Lizard
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    Savage Lizard Charger fan at 7000'

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    Norv is the only coach in San Diego? There are no position coaches? Do all of the position coaches suck as bad as you think Norv does?
  30. DenverBolt67
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    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    I am not saying that some of them definitly would have been better, and am willing to admit that some may have been worse. But the question applies to every player in the league. How many players would have been better in a different situation?

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