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A.J. Smith calls bluffs of Marcus McNeill, Vincent Jackson

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by CoronaDoug, Jun 10, 2010.

  1. Buck Melanoma
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    Not one of us here knows just who is willing to do what.

    Not one.

    I'm moving on & pulling for the team that we have. If VJ & McNeill come in, great. If they don't, it's their decision.
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  2. DenverBolt67
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    The two thing I do KNOW, is that AJ has refused to negotiate a long term deal for either player, and the players are refusing to play on a 1 year deal. I also know that ALL the players who didn't sign their tender, are on teams that refuse to discuss long term deals, and nearly all the big named players who did sign either ended up getting a new contract or are currently in discussions to get a new contract.

    No one says the Bolts have to give these guys what ever they want, but their refusal to even discuss a contract is what has caused this issue
  3. Ride The Lightning
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    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    this

    :icon_toast:
  4. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    Just because you don't agree with his tactics doesn't mean his focus isn't on the team.

    Most people tend to care about the job they're being paid to do and AJ is being paid to build a team.

    And he's not trying to pad anyone's pockets by cutting payroll. They were offered huge raises and they turned it down because it wasn't enough of a raise for them.
  5. DenverBolt67
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    AJ's job is to build a team for this team and for the future. By refusing to negotiate, pissing on the future, and it turned into pissing on this year as well.

    The overall payroll is down significantly, just like nearly every team. The owners are padding their pockets in preparation for a lock out, plain and simple. That is why the PA is getting ready to file collusion charges against the owners.
  6. foober
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    its really pretty simple. Players want huge new 2nd contracts before the new cba takes effect which will probably limit how much a team can spend on them. :yes:
  7. DenverBolt67
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    We wouldn't know since AJ refuses to even talk to them. They may be willing to take less than "market value" for the shot at guaranteed money. But we don't know since the negotiations will never happen.

    I am not pissed about not signing them, I am pissed about not even being willing to talk. If talks happened, and the players wanted ridiculous money, I am cool with not signing them. But since we have no idea what they want, I can't be pissed at the players
  8. HEXEDBOLT
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    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    I know this, the Chargers are going to play this season with who shows up. Pointing fingers and laying blame changes absolutely nothing, VJ and MM will either show up or stay home, the games will still go on.

    I like the fact that Charger management are holding their ground, I also respect the position of the player's in such a volatile game. No right, no wrong, it's time to move on.
  9. foober
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    thats not true. the chargers have been in contact with both for a while now. What ever has been expressed is not what either side can agree on.:yes:
  10. foober
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    THe thing is. The players are being mislead by thier agents. The players have no leverage other than to hold out if they want huge second contracts that the chargers or any team can't pay. Otherwise other teams would have grabbed these players when they could when they were tendered. And they didn't. The players are in a no win situation here. And their agents are gonna hurt them with bad advice to hold out. Meaning the players won't be paid for a year. Or even two years if there is a lockout/strike which looks inevitable.

    The agents I beleive are screwing the players with very bad advice now.:yes:
  11. DenverBolt67
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    Wrong.

    "McNeill, it can be certain, is high on the team’s list of players it wants to sign to long-term deals. Only tight end Antonio Gates, whose contract expires after this season, is likely going to be targeted before McNeill.

    But the Chargers have not even begun talking with Gates, so everyone else has to wait."


    http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2010/jun/13/assigning-blame-tricky-bolts-mess/
  12. DenverBolt67
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    So the teams "can't" pay them? Is that why Brandon Marshall, who was in the same position as VJ, signed his tender and then signed a long term deal to become the richest WR in the history of the game
  13. HollywoodLeo
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    Exactly. His job is to build a team. Not do whatever it takes to keep Vincent Jackson and Marcus McNeil around.

    Both players had a significant raise offered to them and apparently AJ Smith felt that was enough to warrant their services for this year and felt that negotiating was a waste of time because he had no intention of signing them long term.

    Again, you may not agree with these tactics, but that doesn't mean that AJ doesn't care about doing his job. It just means he doesn't feel his job needs to be done the way DenverBolt67 thinks it should be done.

    You want to say pockets are being padded. Why would they offer significant raises to players if they're just trying to pad the pockets of the owners?
  14. DenverBolt67
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    They offered those contracts because that is what they were required to offer, not because they were trying to be nice.

    Just like nearly every other team, the Chargers are trying to pad their pockets in prep for a lock out. The overall team payroll is down with nearly every team, and the ONLY reason for the Chargers to not be in negotiations with Gates and McNeil yet, is because they want to save money.
  15. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    They didn't have to tender them.

    And their reasoning is irrelevant anyways. The bottom line is the offers were on the table and AJ may have felt the offers were sufficient rendering negotiation a pointless waste of time.

    Again, you may not agree with that, but that doesn't make his sole intent padding the pockets of the Spanos family.
  16. foober
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    The teams can pay them. But not to put them in jeopardy of what might happen with the new cba.

    Once the new cba is in place then players will be signed to long term contracts. Its the only safe way to do it.
  17. foober
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    that was written by accee who is almost never right about anything.:yes:

    Some think on purpose. Misinformation agent maybe. hmmm.
  18. S.D.Love
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    :clap::clap::clap::clap:

    I couldn't agree more.

    :flag:
  19. foober
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    The owners are already rich beyond reason. But to keep the players you need to still have a good team in the future you will need to stay within the teams cap very probably after the new cba is finally finalized. Teams have to be careful with contracts this year.

    When the cba is finalized. Probably in two years. THen you'll see players get thier big second contracts. Its just the way it is.
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  20. DenverBolt67
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    You are right, he could have been a moron and just let them walk to a different team. Give me a break.

    Here is what I am talking about with the owners padding their pockets

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5303789&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines
  21. DenverBolt67
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    And they will get them with a different team because AJ gave them the bird
  22. bigmike.x.09
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    bigmike.x.09 Well-Known Member

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    did you read what foober said? league wide. that means the situation will be THE EXACT SAME no matter where they go.
  23. Alpenbolt
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    Still like the thought of two rested probowlers coming back in week 11 for the SB stretch run and only have to pay them a bag of peanuts and a warm soda.
  24. DenverBolt67
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    I was commenting to the last line

    "When the cba is finalized. Probably in two years. THen you'll see players get thier big second contracts. Its just the way it is."

    I said they will get their big 2nd contract, and it will be on another team because AJ gave them a big FU
  25. DenverBolt67
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    Yeah, because they are going to be studs after not practicing with the team all offseason and for 10-11 weeks of the season.

    When they come back, the likelihood of seeing much of either player is slim
  26. bigmike.x.09
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    that makes no sense of aj to do that. theyre both crucial pieces to this team, not essential but crucial. can we manage without? sure we can, we saw it all last season. i dont see why he wouldnt work out a deal with players of their caliber
  27. Alpenbolt
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    :icon_rofl:

    When the come back they will play and they will start. No question.
  28. foober
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    I blame it on thier agents giving them very bad advice. With the new cba not in place yet the teams almost can't come up with an amount they can pay these guys yet. Screwing the players of 3+ million is a sin by the agents.

    Again. The agents are screwing the players here.
  29. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    If all they cared about was saving money, as you keep claiming, he would have been that moron.

    I mean, if all they want to do is save money and line Alex and Dean's pockets who cares if their star players walk, right? I mean, that's what you keep claiming. AJ doesn't care about building the team, he only wants to line the pockets of the owners, right?

    Look, I'm sure the owners like it when they don't have to spend as much money. I'm not going to be naive and pretend they don't care about that at all and that it doesn't factor into decisions to some extent. But that doesn't make that AJ's main intent when he makes a football related decision.

    These guys had significant raises offered to them and AJ more than likely felt that was sufficient to warrant their services for this year. Why negotiate if you have no intent on wavering?

    You may not agree with that. You may think there is a point to negotiating even without that intent. But just because AJ has a different way of doing business doesn't mean the only thing he cares about is saving the Spanos family money.

    As for the link, the PA is going to whine about collusion anytime player salaries start dropping. (or in this case, players don't get long term contracts at times when they normally do)

    That doesn't negate the fact that a team could be risking putting themselves into unknown territory by signing long term deals not knowing what a future CBA will look like.

    Just because the PA wants to cry foul doesn't mean that there aren't other factors involved other than lining greedy owners' pockets when GMs aren't negotiating long term deals with their RFAs.
  30. DesertBoltFan
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    I'd just like to know when does it become a matter of winning a Super Bowl for the Spanos' and not a matter of saving money or lining their pockets?

    You would think by now they'd have made their money and it time to hold the trophy.
    They have had the team since 1985 I believe, and if he hasn't made any money running it yet then he is either a stupid businessman or he needs the tax write off to off set his other companies.:icon_shrug:

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