Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by AnteaterCharger, Nov 10, 2011.
Let's talk draft
What position we need, who, etc?
Top 3 Needs...
1. RT - I don't need to go over this again. My patience with Clary ended 3 years ago.
2. CB - This is the best CB draft in a decade, I can see as many as 5 going in the top 20, I would love to see us tap into that talent pool and move Jammer to SS next year.
3. DE/OLB - Phillips is getting old and English was a bust. But I love Antwan Barnes.
ILB deserves a mention too. Spikes is old, Butler can't cover, and Bird is a scrub.
Side note: Our personell problems wouldn't look this bad if we had coaches who could coach. Our young talent doesn't improve, our old talent is sloppy, our mid range talent is underachieving.
I think the top need is LT. My wife has the same neck condition as McNeill--it's amazing that he plays at all. But the clock is ticking. And this is the 2nd most important position on offense.
Honestly, We dont know if V.Jackson wants to be a bolt next season and M.floyd will be on his contacts' last year next year
So we can use a decent WR (V.Brown has far exceeded my expectations, I love the guy)
We can also use a TE Gates s getting old and although hes a monster we should get someone to develop behind him
On defense theyres a couple things we need I WOULD LOVE TO SEE VONTAZE BURFICT IN A BOLTS UNIFORM
however I dont think hell be available by the time the bolts are on the clock Second we need a solid OLB too, one whos great pass rusher and up to par coverage abilities, I like COURTNEY UPSHAW out of bama, solid player, id love to see him in san diego
Other things we can improve on are RT, I dont think clary is up for the job however i wouldnt use a high draft pick for a T
CB, Jammer is one of my favorite players on Defense however hes getting a little old, Cason is slipping, & Gilchrist (playing great defense) is still learning.
I'd love to see Robert Griffin in a bolts uniform to develop behind P.Rivers, In a couple years when Rivers retires, well have a donovan mcnabb type player
Also don't forget VJ doesnt have a long term contract. So theres a good chance we'll have holes at CB, LT, RT, OLB, ILB, SS, and WR going into this offseason. Not to mention it'd be nice to have Sproles KR/PR/3DRB type guy around again.
And only 3 years ago we spent a 1st round pick on a 3rd CB, an ultimate luxury pick.
I wouldn't move Jammer to SS.. to be an elite team we need a hard hitting guy.. We thought Sanders was going to be it.. who is as effective as Polamalu when healthy and when in his prime.. but that experiment is gone..
Look around the league.. Ravens have a guy like Ed Reed, Steelers have Ryan Clark, Pats have Patrick Chung (Their D sucks but hes a guy who makes big hits and tackles for them, and I hate his cockiness but I would want that on my team), Packers have Nick Collins, Saints have Harper, Giants have Antrell Rolle, etc. etc.
We need a guy like that! Weddle has to improve his coverage skills..
We have a big mess this off season.. We have to cut either Jammer or Cason.. one of the two.. their big contracts that aren't living up to it.. Gregory is not a starter he is more of a back up and role player and Stuckey doesn't have that ability that those names do..
Landry from Washington is out there.. I wouldn't mind stealing Branch from the Raiders.. Cortland Finnegan is a CB who will be a free agent as well.. Would love to have him..
There are plenty of tackles out there in free agency we can snap up.. Staley, Ferguson, McKenzie, etc
I wouldn't resign Floyd.. Brown is emerging and were paying him 2 mill to sit his *** in the trainers office every week GTFO.. I would draft Blackmon, he won't be a top 10 pick imo or even Broyles would be a solid pick.. Ray Ray Armstrong.. from the U.. big hitter, good in coverage.. this is what we need
alot of these Florida guys have trouble off the field though.. so i dont know..
The problem I have with Ray Ray Armstrong is the guy is a walking police blotter - he harkens back to the old U days when players seemed to compete for time on the police radar. If I'm selecting a safety in the draft I'd look real strongly at Mark Barron who I think could be a perfect compliment to Weddle. Ironically I could see a situation where our first three picks are all Crimson Tide players; Upshaw in the first, Barron in the second, Chapman (NT) in the third
I honestly would rather keep Barnes and Phillips and take a guy who is a Patrick Willis/ Demeco Ryans type of backer in Dont'a Hightower if he comes out over Upshaw....I absolutely hate Alabama but love Hightower.
And someone please omfg PLEASE snatch up that punt returner from FSU Greg Reid. Devin Hester is reborn in this kid.
I'm not sure if Barnes is a starter or if he's a very good backup. If its the former then yeah problem solved and let's see about picking up a late round depth pick. If he's the latter then we still need someone to start, and due to our recent problems with pass rush, that takes high priority. Upshaw is very good at OLB and he'd be the top pick. Jenkins seems like an inconsistent one trick pony and i'm not sure Curry or Irvin are better choices in the later rounds.
ILB is a lower ranking priority especially with some very good NT and OT/OG depth in the draft.
Did you see LeGarrett Blount's run today vs the Packers? Thats the kind of stuff you miss out on when you're too worried about character. The man is a beast, and it goes right in the face of every douchebag scout and GM who passed on this kid because they were worried about keeping their white hat.
Meh he has only broke 100 yards 2 times this season, today and against the colts like 4 weeks ago. He has only scored 4 td's and one of those today. Runs hard for sure, but meh he just doesn't wow me at all.
True enough, but the Bucs in general are having a bad year.
Ya it doesnt help for his stats that he is always playing from behind.
Barring certain underclassmen declaring next year's safety class is worse than this year's was... and that's saying A LOT!
Sad thing is too, that in a year where we might be in realistic position to make a move on whoever the elite edge-rusher in the class might be this is a class without one thus far. Upshaw isn't held in has high a regard by scouts as he is by internet pundits and fans; he's seen more as an undersized blue-collar type (again, not a bad pick for us and actually more of the kind of guy we need; but he's not someone I realistically see any GM for us, much less AJ spending a mid-1st on). If Nick Perry declares, though he does need technique work, he's the closest this class has (aside from maybe Whitney Mercilus from Illinois, but he'll also be the most coveted 4-3 RDE). There are a number of tweener prospects who, unless their workouts are off the charts, are likely to fall to the 2nd round - despite what they're being projected at by draft sites currently (e.g. Irvin, Jenkins, Massaquoi, possibly Curry, even possibly Upshaw). Right now Ronnell Lewis is my only sure-fire 1st rounder... besides Burfict who I think will be drafted as a pass-rusher, similar to how Lamar Woodley was (though Burfict has the absolute worst instincts I've seen in a college LB in a looooong time).
I hate the idea of taking an RT in the 1st round, but I equally hate the idea of Clary getting another year of starting time. And this is a quality year for OT's. The only one of the higher rated guys that I really don't like is Andrew Datko (he's absolute garbage). I also think taking a WR in the 1st is overkill - even if we lose VJ (which will only happen in one of two rare instances - either we tag and trade him in which case we'll have another pick to find a replacement for him with, or we're forced to tag Hardwick and either way, if a FA WR has good hands and can run crisp routes, we've seen that Rivers can get the ball to him. In fact, it might benefit us for Philip to not be so dependent on the height of his receivers to be so open to just tossing the jumpball and trusting his guy to come down with it.
ive been looking for gems we could get, who likes this kid for like a 5th or 6th round pick http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/players/1620389/juron-criner
Any position, just take the best player available on the board!!!!! Honestly we could use an upgrade just about everywhere.
This is one year where I would heartily support that draft mentality. We've GOT to get some playmakers on this team, particularly on defense.
Beef on the O-Line I don't care how many receivers you pick if Rivers can't have time to throw and is pummeled all game long it It doesn't matter. Find protection for PR or he may not last here for very long.
Its looking like we will have the 10th or 11th pick in the draft
If we're looking at ILB, I'd rather go for Manti Te'o than Burfect
Thats exactly why we need to draft a Linebacker and Safety with our first two picks.. this should nonetheless be a defensive minded draft.. I would like at least 4 defensive players picked.. and offensive linemen, tight end, and receiver/utility guy - who is great returning kicks, punts, can play running back and receiver..
You're missing his point though. Playmakers can be at many positions and our issues has been that we've pidgeonholed ourselves year after year by need-based drafting to fill holes in the 1st round when we should have been just focusing on adding the most talent player available and find a way to get him on the field so that he can make an impact. The effective strategy is that you use the picks in round 2-7 to build teams around the guys you draft in round 1.
I'm with Buck, as I think this is his ideology too, in that for at least the 1st round throw out the "needs list"... look at the board and unless the position is just already a logjam on our roster you take the most talented (the literal BEST player available) prospect you can regardless of positional need.
And as to the Te'o versus Burfict debate... anyone who advocates for Burfict over Te'o is obviously advocating using a 1st round pick on him and I'd bet dollars to donuts that person hasn't actually watched full Arizona State games and is going entirely off of highlight reels of Burfict's "greatest hits". Burfict is the exact reason why YouTube videos as scouting resources should be taken with a whole shaker of salt; he's effective a larger version of Taylor Mays. His instincts are god awful and that's EXTREMELY relevant. Take Ernie Sims for example, he ran the 40 faster than almost any LB not named Von Miller in recent memory, but his instincts sucked and that speed and burst was utterly wasted. Burfict's also not much of an effort guy - he takes plays off, he coasts along on his athleticism, and there are now reports surfacing that the guy just got up and left in the middle of team meetings just because he wanted to, or flat out didn't attend classes because he didn't want to. The guy might as well have his own official assigned to follow him around the field and flag him for personal fouls because he's good for at least 2-3 per game and blatant ones. He's the Jamarcus Russell of LB's waiting to happen and it's going to take the perfect storm to turn him into the kind of player that ever makes use of his potential. Instincts can be trained but they can never be fully taught. And even if you put him with a disciplinarian type coach who will ride his butt like Seattle Sloop in practice and during games, it's no guarantee that he'll respond to that sort of reinforcement.
My big board as of right now (realistically)
1. Jonathan Martin RT Stanford (would finally get rid of Jeromey Clary, give Rivers two outstanding bookends)
2. Dre Kirkpatrick CB Alabama (Just on a talent basis, would still like to see what we have with our young guys)
3. Nic Perry OLB USC (Starting to wonder if Upshaw is top 15 pick, Perry talent wise is, refinement wise is a while away)
4. David DeCastro OG Stanford (Yes I'd spend it on a guard, gets us a great RG and potential Dielman replacement)
5. Manti Te'o/Luke Kuechly ILB ND/BC (Value alone)
I see that WalterFootball is continuing to rot your brain.
Do you honestly think that AJ (or the next guy) is going to spend a top 12 pick on a right offensive tackle?
Better to look at FA for that position IMO.
You mean AJ's going to be back? News to me
I think there's one RT I'm specifically looking at in FA - Demitrius Bell from buffalo. Very good RT. Beyond that there's better OG options then there are tackles in FA. And based on how poorly our OL has been and how much protection we need for Rivers, I think investing in another tackle high up is very worth it - Especially one as talented as Martin
There's been no confirmation that AJ is out.
And I'm not sold on Martin. Luck's quick release helps to make him look good. IF we were to go OT in the first, I like Reiff better. You can hardly ever go wrong with a talent like that coached up by Kirk Firenz AND he's a legit LT option.
Perhaps you can provide a link to the article discussing his termination, because until we have such objective evidence, yo councelor appear to be couting chickies before the pop out of dem shell...
Separate names with a comma.