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Is Norv to blame for Rivers crashing?

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by matilack, Nov 12, 2007.

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Is Norv to blame for Rivers regression?

  1. Yes, Norv is to blame.

    12 vote(s)
    38.7%
  2. No, Rivers just sucks.

    2 vote(s)
    6.5%
  3. Both.

    9 vote(s)
    29.0%
  4. Neither, its just a sophomore slump.

    8 vote(s)
    25.8%
  1. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    There is no doubt in my mind that when AJ Smith drafted Philip Rivers he saw that certain X factor, the substance that makes winners. And he was 100% right......at least while Marty was our coach. All us fans were taken in as well by his talent, poise, brains, and fiery leadership that led us to back to back comebacks when down by 21 and 17 points at half-time. Rivers only real draw back was how he got overexited in the 1st half of the game and made some mistakes.


    Then the offseason turmoil that doesnt need repeating.........


    Then they announced Norv Turner as successor to Marty Shottenheimer, and the first thing I thought was "We wont be as good, but Rivers will get much better." Norv was known as a guy who built something out of nothing with QB's, and the guy who was responsible for Troy Aikman's success in Dallas. And I thought that smarts and his calm nature may actually help Rivers keep his composure throughout games.


    So I guess the question is......Are Rivers and Norv like fire and water?
    We all knew Marty was a very intense guy, very cliche, he had a very college like inspiration about him. Or as I like to call it playing hard without being reckless, which is exactly what I saw when I looked at Rivers, and thats why I think they worked well together.
  2. Zeus
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    Zeus BoltTalker

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    Norv isn't to blame.

    Look at the 2nd half of 2006. I mean even comparing the games he has a decent completion when only passing for about 15 against EASY defensive teams and when he had short passes and a lot of time in the pocket. Also PRs was a new QB and teams didn't know how to scheme for him they do now.

    Norv can't make PR make bad decisions, throw weak balls, have little mobility, and fumble the ball. PRs has done this before.

    Besides PRs right now is doing worst than any QB Norv has ever had.
  3. Critter
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    Critter BoltTalker

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    Sure, it cant be Norv's fault. After all, the entire offense is thriving with the exception of Rivers.:icon_huh:
  4. BOLTS4LIFE
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    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    Rivers is fire and Norv is water.
  5. Zeus
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    Zeus BoltTalker

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    Only P. Rivers and our O-line is struggling. Our receivers are getting open and catching decent balls. LT is having some problems due to O-line and the fact that defenses scheme only for LT and not our QB.

    Even in 2005 they had to worry about Brees. Now they just have a few guys cover our Wrs and blitz hoping that the guys they leave open (and they our open) don't get the ball. P. Rivers crumbles like a lawn chair with ANY pressure and makes bad decisions. Our receivers get open so much and he still throws it poorly. Look I would agree most of it was Norv IF our receivers weren't getting open. The fact is they are.

    They challenge P. Rivers to beat them and he can't. Hell we can't even trust him to do shovel passes.

    Our O-line is a problem as well. Perhaps they had it too easy with such an easy schedule as last year. Perhaps McNeil needs his casts back. Whatever the case is our O-line is worst than last year even though we have the same Asst. Coach.

    Now you can say our O-line isn't motivated by Norv which is too bad. A lot of coaches don't give huge speeches and frankly I don't care if they don't respect Norv. You play the game. If you need a speech to stir yourself up then go watch TV.

    Look I would be more inclined to believe you if the signs didn't show themselves last season, which they did. Maybe if there were new problems, which there aren't. He is bad under pressure and always has been. He is slow with a weak arm. He needs a lot of talent and a lot of time to play well. He is hot and cold and always has been so.
  6. henryqjr2001
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    henryqjr2001 BoltTalker

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    Norv has gotten the blame for a lot of what has gone wrong this season.... But why has PR regressed so much... lousy decisions, short arming throws, fumbling snaps. Is he hurt? Even if he is he won't say it. Yea, he is a firey guy...emotions get the best of all of us ( are you listening NORVAL) but maybe he needs some time to cool his heels. Like sitting on the bench, maybe that will straighten his a** out.
  7. RipTheJacker
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    RipTheJacker Well-Known Member

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    anyone who thinks Norv is ruining Rivers needs to turn on MNF and watch Alex Smith

    The guy was garbage as a rookie and had a Leaf like rookie year, last year he improved his QB rating by like 30 points, now that norv is gone, he is back to the garbage QB he was as rookie

    same thing happened with Kerry Collins, brad johnson, Gus Ferroute etc....

    It seems that #17 is the only one who cant run Norvs offense
  8. OverVolt
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    OverVolt BoltTalker

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    As I always said when Drew was here...the QB's play is a direct reflection of the total offense's play. WHen the offense is clickin' so is the QB, when the running game is going nowhere, and the WR's can't get open, then the QB will suffer.
    Remember a good offense will make a good QB, but a good QB can't make a good offense.
    I would say we have a good QB that can't make a good offense...this O-line is the whole problem, and it's not because of physical ability...we saw they had that last year. It's because they've lost the mental edge they had last year.
    Last year the attitude along our O-line was "we can run on anybody"...this year I don't see that at all.
    Last year this team was full of "tough guys", and that was a reflection of Marty...this year the team is reflecting something totally different, and it's got to do with this HC.
    Norv is a yes man, that's why AJ brought him in here, to do what "the ego" says, and don't cause waves...in other words, Norv is no tough guy, he's a company guy/wimp...this team is simply starting to follow the mentality of it's HC.
    IT'S THE ATTITUDE THAT'S HELPING BRING RIVERS AND THIS WHOLE TEAM DOWN.
  9. nickelbolt
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    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    Norv is not 100% to blame, but if he's the one calling plays he certainly has a lot to do with PRs struggles.

    He continues to put this offense in situations where everything depends on Rivers being perfect. And it seems like just about every time there's a critical pass that needs to be made, Rivers is either being blindsided or running for his life.

    You'd think that by now Norv has realized he needs to get Rivers into a rhythm. That doesn't mean you ask him to drop back 5-7 steps and throw 12-15 yard patterns every time. It means you get him in Shotgun, go no huddle, run 5-7 yard patterns, crossing patterns, etc.

    It looks like Norv has a plan for the first couple of offensive series. Then he just starts calling plays without any real plan in mind. He's doing very little to help his QB, that's for sure.
  10. HEXEDBOLT
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    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    Are you related to the girl with kaleidoscope eyes?
  11. bigcarson50
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    bigcarson50 New Member

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    No one has ever knocked Norv as a coordinator.

    Has he ever groomed a QB as a HC?
  12. HEXEDBOLT
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    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    All Norv has to do is ask Dip, the best QB in the league is sitting on our bench.
  13. nickelbolt
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    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    That's what's so unique about this particular situation. He doesn't really need to "groom" PR. What he needs to do is simply address Rivers' strengths and weaknesses and then develop a game plan accordingly. This is strictly a coordinator issue. If he's the one developing the gameplans and calling plays, he should be able to help Philip find his rhythm. If he can't do that, then he needs to hand it over to Shelmon and start focusing on running this team as a head coach.
  14. HEXEDBOLT
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    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    :tup:
  15. foober
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    foober BoltTalker

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    I agree. NOrv has to adjust to what Rivers can do. Not have Rivers adjust to what Norv wants. Any player is limited on what they can do. And a coach has to realize that and work with that.

    And the o-line has to block better. Hope those guys do extra work the rest of this year to improve.
  16. bigcarson50
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    bigcarson50 New Member

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    I think your first sentence applies to your second sentence as well.
  17. !~BOLT~!
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    !~BOLT~! Well-Known Member

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    I voted no, but they both do suck. Does that count? Was it Norv that turned his arm into yogurt slinging fettuccini?
  18. Alpenbolt
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    Alpenbolt BoltTalker

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    What we are seeing is not Chargers football.

    1. We can't run. We are not dominating the line of scrimmage.
    2. We give up record amounts of yardage on the ground.
    3. No pass rush.

    How do I know this is not Chargers football?

    1. We scored 2 special teams TDs. We never do that.
    2. We picked off 6 passes in a game. That is normally the season total.

    Everything is upside down this year. Only coaching can get things that screwed up.

    The good news is with the world upside down maybe that means we actually find ways to win some playoff games. Win the division at 9-7, Rivers pulls his head out of his azz after sitting on the bench for a few games and we get on a little roll.
  19. Chargers-Superhero
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    Chargers-Superhero Just win the Damn SB !!!

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    Norv has ruined our team this year. Bad play calling, going away from the run, not a great HC at all. Along with fat boy TED running the defense. Nobody is really happy with Norv, and his excuses 9 games into the season are getting old at his press conferances. He can't manage a game properly as a HC. He has proven that time and time again. Being an OC and only an OC is not the same as HC. I don't give a crap about how he helped Alex Smith last year or what he did with Troy Aikman 15 years ago. HE WAS NOT THE HC OF THOSE TEAMS!! There is no reason our team should play this bad 9 games into the season with ALL our talent. Dallas, and Pittsburgh seem to be doing just fine with thier "new" coaches this year, why arn't we???!!! BECAUSE NORV AND TED SUCK :icon_evil::icon_evil::icon_evil::icon_evil:
  20. PowderLove
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    PowderLove Former Mod, Current Slacker

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    Somebody said Norv gives the plays to Whitehurst, who then relays them to PR, right? I think Charlie is sabotaging Rivers. Norv just doesn't notice what's going on.

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