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McCoy Telesco so far....

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Heir Coryell, Oct 18, 2013.

  1. Heir Coryell

    Heir Coryell BoltTalker

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    Can we just take a moment to realize how much better of an offensive coach Mike McCoy is than Norv Turner? The mere fact that they have changed the offense to suit the skills of the players rather than trying to stuff a square peg in a round hole like Turner did is awesome.

    Letting Rivers call the plays at the line.
    Taking 3 step drops with an average Oline
    Having rookie players be involved immediately although time to get L.Green in even more
    Mixing formations that keeps the defense guessing with true play action and running backs that can catch rather than one dimension RBs on 1st and 2nd down when the defense knows what you're going to do


    Even with all the injuries (and there have been as many if not more under McCoy than at any time during Turner's reign), McCoy has the offense humming and how about McCoy justifiably wanting to rip Mathews head off for stepping out of bounds? Awesome. We never would have seen that with Turner.

    I think we are seeing how talented Telesco is as well. This past draft has been awesome so far. They are jettisoning dead weight that AJ had screwed the pooch on and bringing in YOUNG guys who can play for the most part although Pagano has got to shore up that secondary.

    We are still losing some close games, but the attitude is turning from 'oh woe is us' to 'no excuses, we're gonna take this game'. I kinda wish we'd lose a little more cuz the way Tom T's first draft went with high picks next year and injured players coming back - we can make some noise and rival Denver. Defensive playmaker anyone?

    McCoy/Telesco are exactly what this franchise needed to bring it back from the depths. I don't think I'm being rah rah about this - I just wanted to point it out while it was happened and appreciate it.
     
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  2. Fossil

    Fossil BoltTalker

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    You lost me with "I kinda wish we'd lose a little more..." but yeah, I like what McCoy/Telesco bring to this team.
     
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  3. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    So far very happy with the era. Telesco did alot with a paired down budget (Woodhead, Dunlap), made some real statements early with troublesome players, and has hit pretty well on his first three draft picks. I'd wish he didn't run off some obviously needed vets like he did (Garay and Barnes come to mind) but by and large he's done well. McCoy has brought a great new system and it's borne immediate fruit in the offense. I would like him to attack a little more vertically but again no major complaints
     
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  4. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Norv is gone. I will take no time to reflect on where we were. My time is taken up focusing on where we are and where we wish to go.
     
  5. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Only 1 major complaint...letting Phillips sign a 1 year minimum deal with Denver. And letting Barnes go too, you have to keep one of those guys.
     
  6. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I think Telesco, McCoy, Whisenhunt, Coach D, Pagano, Reich have all been on the money for what they have been able to accomplish. Even if this team doesn't go anywhere I believe McCoy should get coach of the year just for knowing the obvious and taking a struggling Rivers and ressurecting him back into the borderline elite player he once was

    Just imagine what this coaching staff could have done if the players were healthy and we had talent
     
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  7. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    It's waaaaaaay too early to tell.

    Anyone seriously celebrating a 3-3 record is probably either unbelievably hopeful
    or mostly trying to make a commentary about the previous regime.


    Call me "old fashioned" but I'll call it an "upgrade" when the facts say it's an upgrade...
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2013
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  8. ETicket

    ETicket Well-Known Member

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    I'm celebrating but I haven't decided if I'm serious or not. How can you tell? :p
     
  9. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Thoroughly agreed and compounded by the injuries to 3/4 of our initial starting OLB group. And the fact we let two decent pass rushers go for nothing was the biggest mistake of Telesco otherwise successful rookie season
     
  10. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    ****, if we were 3-3 at this point last year we'd be pissed. Ah **** we were 3-3 at this point last year and pissed.
     
  11. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Well I'm not exactly happy with 3-3, we could easily be 5-1, probably should be given the manner in which we lost
     
  12. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    Point being, a lot more bitching at 3-3 under Norv than under the new regime.
    Not that I give a ****. I'm a fan of the Parcells + analysis: "You are what your record says you are" + if you're soft on D you're worse than your record, if you have a good pass rush, you're better. In the past 5-6 years, the Chargers have been worse than their record. I'm hoping that's not going to hold this year, but their pass rush sucks.
     
  13. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    This is compartmentalized thinking and a syndrome unique to SD fans!

    In 2007 Mart...uh er Chargers fans...supposedly hated Norv for not going 14-2...when he won two playoff games that season, they hated him even more!

    AJ by this time was already destroying the team but Chargers fan still loved him (myself included)

    in 2008, again the hate was more noticeable after a playoff win against the best team in the NFL more so than the excited hate for a 8-8 season. We are at this point 2 seasons removed from the most talented team in the NFL. Norv's ability to win with what he has and the hatred for him continues to mask AJ's now horrible GM'ing,i.e., Because they keep winning and because Chargers fan hates Norv, AJ must be kicking azz!

    in 2009, The hate reached unparalleled proportions when Norv took an even worse schit team to 13-3. Chargers fan was happier than Jets fan that Nate missed three field goals but unlike the time Marty ran onto the field to lose a game, the giddy blame was placed square on the shoulders of a guy who got a **** roster to a 13-3 regular season. Again, Chargers fan couldn't see how schit the roster had become under AJ.

    the team got worse every year after this and especially at key o positions and depth. To give credit to Chargers fan, he finally at the end of this time, started blaming AJ too...the problem however is that he never came correct on the Norv hate which was there from day one. So what used to be weirdly blaming Norv for all his better than Marty seasons, morphed into making AJ and Norv the same person!

    So if Chargers fan is truly past the "old regime", why then lump MM and TT together? TT is unintentionally getting screwed because of this cognitive dissonance negotiating... This team is far better than last year's where it counts most (o-line, healthy slot, scat back) and MM has made some dumb mistakes (eligibility?) that at least one of which ( playing for a punt with a schit secondary) he thinks was a good idea. But because the narrative is still "Hate Norv", AJ is being let off the hook to a great degree and Telesco is being dissed while rewriting Chargers fans beg that the additions of Fluker, Woodhead and Dunlap be ignored. Not to mention the slot is healthy with Royal and so too the TE with a 100 percent Gates.

    I like TT alot, am worried about MM, and like Wisenhunt. But the biggest change on this team by far is TT over AJ. Chargers fan hates being wrong even more than they hate Norv but maybe if they could see they are logically hating on TT while trying to have it all ways, they'd have a moment of reflection and become better fans. Nah! just kidding about all of that :helm1:
     
  14. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Fans are a lot more forgiving on the new regime, in 6 years if this team shows no signs of improvements I promise you there will be plenty of B#$%ng

    forget the record for a second, just what this team has been able to do on offense has impressed me so far. I believe this team is truly a year or two away from being contenders, so as long as they continue to build and improve, I'm happy
     
  15. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    THIS
     
  16. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    Exactly. Most of us backed Norv for his first few seasons until the wheels started to come off and the leaks and holes became more and more apparent as the team became more Norvous.

    For a 1st time HC/GM combo, a team riddled with injuries clearly in rebuilding mode, I think 3-3 is respectable, albeit a bit annoying knowing it could be 5-1 with a couple more plays by here and there. I can live with it for now as long as I see improvement and I do.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2013
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  17. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    I'm with you on the offense. Definitely a better mesh with Rivers/Whizzers system than Norv's 90s mgmt style.
    Defense is an issue. Great game against Colts. Crap against Raiders. I expect the insanity on D to continue until Pags shows otherwise. Up to McCoy to direct Pags here. No excuse for the shite against Raiders.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2013
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  18. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    I think that's because it felt like we were on a treadmill with AJ/Norv, slowly sliding backward towards the eventual 4-12 season. Even if this team was 1-5 right now I doubt you'd see the same vitriol for McCoy and Telesco in year 1, just based on hope for the future.
     
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  19. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    That's my point. Though it's all wound up in several consecutive crap drafts by AJ.
    Like I say, on the O side, the new coaches designed a system around Rivers (and his crap OL) rather than around their past successes.
    On the D side, not sure what Pags is thinking (but let's hope the new coaches are getting him off the old system).
     
  20. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    Like the players we have left over from Norv, he just needs a few more immunizations to get the Norvitis out of his system. :D
     
  21. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Im back and forth on Pags. Part of me is annoyed by his scheme this year, the other part thinks this defense just doesn't have talent anyway. It's hard to blame a guy for not blitzing and pressing the DBs when he's stuck with guys like Tourek Williams and Larry English. So I kind of want to defend the guy a little.

    I have a feeling (regretfully) that the Colts game is the best this defense can play.
     
  22. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    Having never been part of a football coaching staff, I don't know (I'm a hockey guy, we wipe the slate clean, it's a helluva lot less complicated than football).

    But what the ****, if the DC is a pussy, fix it fast. I get what you're saying, just seems strange to finally fix it in week 6 (?). Maybe Dean-o passing orders down to keep Pags? Hell I don't know, but the D scheme last game was appreciated.
     
  23. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    But that's it in a nutshell: why don't we play it the way we did against the Colts? Sure some QBs are going to gash us on the ground more than Luck, but why not change it up the way we did against the Colts? Strange to see that this far in.
    It was as if McCoy was thinking, 'wtf, our D DOES suck! let's fix it.'
    If Henne kills us, we'll know.....uh...****....let's face facts, this next game will show us nothing.
     
  24. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    They haven't really accomplished much up to this point. Sure, some faces and names have changed and the offense is different and seems to have improved. Then look to the defense and ST's and the memory of 4 & 69 keep materializing or two blocked field goals burn and turn in the mind.

    I like the newness but the journey has just begun and there is still such a long road ahead with still unknown obstacles at the ready to blow out a tire or two. Should make for a fun trip.
     
  25. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I 100% agree, my exact feeling, but I am giving him the benefit of the doubt that its more of being stuck with Williams and English as his pass rushers but I hate seeing on 3rd and 10 his DB's play off what looks to be 30 yards off the ball sometimes, with no safety help up top. I love the Clemson Marcus Gilchrist, but this dude we have playing safety have been far from impressive, I am praying Taylor comes back and takes the job, as he looked like the better of the two of what little game tape to go by. Thank god Hey Bey dropped that one pass because after the CB got burnt Gilchrist doesn't come into the picture until the play is well over.

    Albeit, the lack of LB's was going to soon come down to "Row F Seat 32 please come down to be fitted for a jersey and receive your playbook" it was actually genius rolling out there with those defensive schemes of having 7 db's to having none on the D line have a hand on the ground looking like 11 men were blitzing.
     
  26. EOTL

    EOTL BoltTalker

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    With the team only having played 6 games, there isn't a really big sample of data for us to work with, but I like what I'm seeing so far. 2 of Telesco's top 3 picks haven't exploded yet (shout out to Keenan Allen), but all look at least serviceable so far. As for McCoy, it looks like he, Whiz and Reich have succeeded at doing the one thing that every analyst out there said they had to do: "fix" Philip Rivers.

    Still, we are only at 3-3 when the team could have been at 6-0, given the close finishes in each loss. Either way, I'm not complaining about M^2 and T^2.
     
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  27. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    Long ways to go, it ain't chaingin o' night. So far, I like what I have seen, Now, they just need to keep moving in a positive direction.
     
  28. Fossil

    Fossil BoltTalker

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    Agree with Hexedbolt. I'm happy with the offense and have reservations about the D and ST.
    Back to the offense for a second. Long term, IMHO the Boltz' success hinges partly on whether they can keep scoring without Rivers, when (and if) he misses time due to injury. To my eye McCoy and Whiz have installed a scheme that's flexible enough to make it easier for the next man up to function. With Norv's rigidity, we'd have been pooched for sure.
     
  29. FCBolt

    FCBolt Well-Known Member

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    Sample size of 1 so far, but at least we can beat the **** out of teams we should beat the **** out of.
     
  30. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Sample size of 2 so far, but at least we can beat the **** out of 1 of the 2 teams we should've beat the **** out of.
     

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