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Mel Kiper is off his nut

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by Blue Bolt, Apr 4, 2012.

  1. Blue Bolt
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    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Here's Kiper's draft projection for the Chargers in the 1st and 2nd round......... :cautious:

    18. San Diego: Chandler Jones, LB, Syracuse

    49. San Diego: Doug Martin, RB, Boise State
  2. jackfrost
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    jackfrost Well-Known Member

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    Who ? [​IMG]

    NO, not Kiper, the other blokes you mentioned !!!
  3. Concudan
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    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    So by saying he is 'off his nut' are you saying the man normally is on his or a nut?

    Not saying that anything is wrong with that... But surprising what revilations are revealed in a fan forum...
  4. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    I've defended Kiper in the past but this is just silly. Everyone says Chandler Jones is versatile and can play in the 3-4, but there is absolutely ZERO proof of that. Syracuse never played 3-4, ever, and an ever bigger problem is Jones is one of the stiffer less agile pass rushers in this draft when he's on the line, so I can just imagine the disaster if you tried to get him to cover someone.
    I would consider him in the 2nd round, but no higher for any 3-4 team except maybe the Patriots who are hybrid.

    I don't hate the Doug Martin pick because I really like him as a player, no matter what I think he's a guy fans fall in love with due to his consistant ability to move the ball forward. But its a luxury pick and I don't want to see it happen, we need to go defense or OG here.
  5. Ikeman83
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    Ikeman83 Werter Pöbel

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    RB in the second round?



    ...Dies...
  6. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I just lost all respect for Kiper. Fire him from ESPN NOW.
  7. Blue Bolt
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    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Exactly....... what I've read about Chandler makes him sound like a poor choice as a 3-4 OLB. He's better off as a down lineman in a 4-3.

    But then, all the "experts" had Liuget going to a 4-3 team, and AJ decided he was smarter than the conventional wisdom once again. :p
  8. AnteaterCharger
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    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    More like he just phoned it in.
  9. Buck Melanoma
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    Buck Melanoma Guest

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    But but but ..... isn't Kiper a gawd like AJ? :roflmao::roflmao::roflmao:
    • Funny Funny x 2
  10. Moses
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    Moses Yeah Buddy!

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    Stranger things have happened... Although I would be extremely disappointed with either pick, the sad thing is that part of me fears stuff like this happening every draft.

    My friends still laugh at my supposed facial expression when I said "Who the f@#$ is Larry English??!!!" and "MOUTON?????!!! WTF?!" lol.

    With the 18th pick of the 2012 draft, the San Diego Chargers select [enter name of a second round prospect] :(
  11. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    You need a few more AJ drafts then. Larry was a complete surprise and he wasnt a surprise at all.
  12. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Jones in the 2nd is a gamble I might take. Look at the genetics that are running wild in that family (his older brothers are UFC Light-Heavyweight Champion Jon Jones and Ravens' DL and former Syracuse BEAST - prior to knee injury - Arthur Jones); they are just a family that is freakishly athletic, all of the boys wrestled in high school (and each other) growing up, and their work ethics are off the charts. Is he a guy I'd particularly want dropping into coverage? Hell no. But if what we want is a guy that - at least initially (i.e. first 2 years) - is primarily concerned with wreaking havoc on opposing QB's, we could do a lot worse than Chandler - you just have to adjust the scheme to accommodate him like you do most non outright-studs. I can definitely see Tamba Hali potential in Jones.

    The Martin pick is just dumb. Sorry, I'm not on the Martin hype train - I think he's getting a lot of hype right now because he's a "safe" pick but there's very little that stands out to me about his game on tape that makes me stand up and think of him as a dynamic player in anyway. He's a broke man's (not poor... broke-as-a-joke) Ray Rice, but I've heard that comparison drawn way, way too many times before. Rice had/has far superior vision to what martin exhibits.

    As to Kiper.. don't get me started. All this guy does is shill for the agents he's friends with or on the take from, this has been a known fact for a number of years. He used to be able to legitimately scout players in the past, but you compare his breakdowns of players back in the late 90's to his breakdowns now and everything nowadays is so formulaic and vanilla that he's using the same buzzwords that mean next to nothing. Literally, the guy sounds like Gruden doing commentary and glowing about how he "loves this guy here... and here's the bass-ackwards reasoning why".
  13. rickochey
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    rickochey BoltTalker

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    Kiper definitely has given AJ the benefit of the doubt. Kiper has AJ picking an American in the first round. Very conservative on Kipers part. Very interesting indeed. muhahhaha
  14. AnteaterCharger
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    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    For amusement's sake, here's Todd McShay's mock draft

    18. Cordy Glenn, OT/G, Georgia
    The Chargers have addressed many needs in free agency, but Jeromey Clary is clearly not the answer at right tackle. Glenn is a massive (6-5¾, 345), powerful prospect who would boost the running game and help keep QB Philip Rivers clean in the pocket.
    Options: Kirkpatrick, Martin, Merclius (Perry goes in the second, H. Smith goes in the first)

    49. Chargers Alameda Ta'amu NT Washington
    Options: Ronnell Lewis, Brandon Taylor, Vinny Curry


    At least this one is semi coherent
  15. rickochey
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    rickochey BoltTalker

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    at least it makes more sense. i like the idea of getting Glenn.
  16. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    McShay is quickly turning into Kiper version 2 though. Both of the guys prognosticate to death on what they think teams should do, not what they think teams will do. And where I'm less inclined to trust them on the "should's" than say a guy like Casserly (not saying I love the guy, but he knows his ish better than Kiper or McShay do), Floyd Reese, or heck even Eric Mangini is that Kiper/McShay have just as many hits as misses on the prospects they've "loved". Or need we forget that at one point McShay was all over Jimmy Clausen's junk as not only being a 1st round prospect but, midway through that collegiate season, as a better prospect than Bradford?

    Kiper and McShay have about as much credibility as Jamie Dukes - they blow and bluster, but they don't consider anything aside from the prospect (like scheme, or character issues that they just completely dismiss). Mayock's no gem, but at least he's a bit more holistic in his approach.
  17. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    So who is good then?

    Banks?
    Brooks?
    Lombardi?
    Reuter?
    Rang?
    Kirwan?
    Lande?
    Brugler?
    Judge?
    I know how much you love Walter Cherepinski.;)

    Personally I like Greg Cossell's take on players, and I find myself agreeing with Lombardi more than not.
  18. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    A few others from the internet pundits whose views I tend to place a bit more value in...

    From Rob Rang's Mock (dated 4/9):
    18. San Diego Chargers
    [​IMG] Andre Branch, DE, Clemson: The Chargers took a big step in addressing their pass rush concerns with the free agent addition of former Baltimore outside linebacker Jarrett Johnson. Don't expect that to be the end of San Diego's focus on improving their pass rush, however, especially considering that Peyton Manning has now joined the division. Branch has the length, speed and flexibility that every team is looking for in an outside pass rusher and is moving up the board as the draft nears.

    (Mercilus, Kuechly, Decastro, Barron, and Ingram all already off the board; Perry, Floyd, Glenn, Kirkpatrick still available)

    17. San Diego Chargers
    [​IMG] Jamell Fleming, CB, Oklahoma: The Chargers starting tandem of Quentin Jammer and Antoine Cason didn't play up to their usual standards a year ago. With Peyton Manning added to the division, smart and versatile defenders like Fleming would be a welcome addition to the secondary.

    (Silatolu, Boykin, Dwayne Allen, Osemele, and Iloka still available; Harrison Smith, Josh Robinson, Lavonte David already off the board)

    I'm compiling... I'll edit more in.
  19. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    No one's perfect. I tend to trust the guys who attend the school pro days, the post-season games, the combine, etc. and have had a chance to actually sit down and talk to the several of the players. Kirwan knows his stuff, but he's got an ego the size of Kiper's and is still fishing for a more significant gig at a network than he's got, so he's constantly making slightly more outrageous projections hoping to get one or two he can re-make his name off of. As far as guys who actually understand how to analyze the metrics that the combine drills and measurements spit out, he and Russ Lande (though Lande also has a ton of personal bias against certain programs and in trying to play favoritism towards front offices he likes). Clark Judge knows his stuff too, but the guy is a better study of prospects than he is of front offices - in fact, he blatantly discounts the impact of front office trends and tendencies way too much if it conflicts with his own belief of what should be done.

    Rob Rang is a good mid-level guy. He's not perfect in his scouting, but he approaches it the right way from everything I can tell. James Christensen is a similar case, though unlike Rang he actually attends a fair amount of the aforementioned post-season games and pro days. Dan Kadar's good, but he's so slow to update his site and stuff - hopefully in the next month he and SB Nation cohort Ryan Van Bibble (who is one of the best at actually keeping tabs on front office trends and tendencies and sniffing out smokescreens) will collaborate and churn out a bit more material.

    Josh Sanchez is also someone who's quickly growing on me. He knows his stuff, but he doesn't do a ton of his own scouting (i.e. he relies on other folks at the sites he's worked for to do a lot of the grunt work, but he's got a much better understanding of team schemes, front office tendencies, etc.), and thus it generally takes him a bit to get over his man-crushes on certain players even if they're proven to not be as dynamic as originally thought.

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