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Mock Drafts

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by SuperCharger92, Jan 7, 2013.

  1. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    Updated top 10 mock after Oakland and Arizona settle their QB situation (if you want to call it settled:roflmao:)

    1. KC - Luke Joeckel
    2. JAX - Dee Milliner
    3. OAK - Shariff Floyd
    4. PHI - Star Lotulelei
    5. DET - Eric Fisher
    6. CLE - Tavon Austin
    7. ARZ - Lane Johnson
    8. BUF - Geno Smith
    9. NYJ - Dion Jordan
    10. TEN - Ziggy Ansah


    11. SD - Barkevious Mingo - Whatever. Still a better value pick than Warmack or Cooper.
  2. Boltjolt
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    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    Not a better player so i dont agree. I do not like Mingo for us. Or Jarvis Jones.

    IMO Warmack and Cooper can step in day one and be effective and help the OL. I dont not feel that way about Mingo. I know some like him but i cant help but see Manny Lawson.
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  3. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    So can JC Tretter, Justin Pugh, Kyle Long, Earl Watford and they can all be had in the 2nd round and as late day 3.

    I actually might take Werner over Mingo though, I'm just not convinced he can cover anyone.
  4. Boltjolt
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    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    Maybe some of them can. I see Warmack and Cooper being great OG's for years. I dont even see Mingo being a full time starter with his lanky undersized self. I know what the experts have said but at his size and imo, his inability to get bigger, i think he is a 4-3 DE.

    Just to throw this out there.....did you know most of the top 10 OL of all time are OG's? Warmack could be one of those guys and im not usually for going OG real high but over Mingo, Jones and yes, Werner i would. Im not real high on Werner either. The only first round OLB's i like for us is Jordan.

    Werner was always playing against the RT's in college and Carradine was always against the LT's. Id actually love to get Carradine in the second round since his knee injury is coming around nicely.
  5. Bolts4lyfe
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    Let me first off start off saying I agree with you, we have to get one of these OT's but we simply cannot afford to trade up. Right now we are stuck between a rock and a S#$%%y situation, but if we don't get one of the big 3 LT's its still too early to suggest the season is over before it began. Although he's not who I want at LT long term, we do have King Dunlap. Dunlap actually graded out pretty well as a pass protector, was actually on par with Vollmer. Like the top QB needy teams, they all backed themselves up with QB's, we backed ourselves up with a tackle.

    Lets say we do miss out on the top 3 tackles, we take one of the elite OG's who still pass protect as well as run block, then we grab Armstead, Watson, Pugh etc. one of these guys who may need some time but contribute eventually, (kind of like Cordy Glenn in Buffalo) If they struggle we still have Dunlap, if they don't we'll all be ecstatic, Rivers especially. Another guy who may be a good later pick up is David Quessenberry. When all is said and done the line will still look a lot better than it did last year.

    Last note, who ever is there at 11 will be a good player. Lets just hope he's an LT.
  6. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    We can't afford to trade up?
    Or we can't afford to let Rivers get blasted relentlessly again?

    We absolutely can afford to trade up, the question is how much we're willing to sacrifice, and thats where it gets interesting. Cleveland for example signed Kruger so they filled that need, they won't get Milliner at 6, and its too early for Austin, Patterson, Rhodes, Ogletree or Te'o...I can see them trading down in a bargain. And as we and Miami are probably the only teams in the top 15 with a serious need to trade up its not like we're going to get into a bidding war for the #6 pick. Why would they turn down a 3rd if we offered it too them? A chance to slide back, take Tavon Austin or Xavier Rhodes at value, and bag an extra 3rd (and maybe a day 3 pick next year) in the process?

    What do we get? Security for our franchise player, instead of a raw product like Teron Armstead coming out of the FCS. What did we sacrifice? Maybe a Kiko Alonso....I can live with that.
  7. Bolts4lyfe
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    Not an NFL GM so I can't make this happen but what if we missed out on the 3 OT's, How much would Rodger Saffold cost us? Maybe all it would cost would be a swap of our 11th for their 22nd? I don't know, But I'd be very happy with that. McCoy hasn't mentioned who his LT is, but he did say they're going to bring in some guys. Im sure there is a plan in place for what they would like to do.
  8. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    Not sure at all. Considering he doesn't want to play RT and he's just kind of taking up space on the Rams roster.....maybe we could have him for a 4th, I'm not really sure.

    Also funny how you're hearing nothing about Brandon Albert. Sad truth for the Chiefs is that the CHARGERS are the team with the biggest LT need after free agency. And the Dolphins are probably done spending money, the Cardinals have no money, and neither do the Lions who are all but guaranteed one of the top 3 OTs anyway in the draft.

    I would be very surprised if they got more than a 3rd for him, and probably less if they wait until draft day and take Joeckel #1....because then everyone knows they have to dump him! They are bargaining from a position of weakness.
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  9. Riff Raff
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    IMO, if we don't decide to trade down (after the top 3 OT's are gone) & either of Cooper or Warmack are there (yes, that's my order of preference of the 2), the team would be stupid NOT to take one of them. The ONLY way I see that changing might be if Milliner or MAYBE Lotulelei are there.
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  10. SuperCharger92
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    Now that I think of it, Rodger Saffold isn't worth it, at least to trade for. Your going to give up atleast a 3rd rounder for him, and you only have him for one season, then he's a free agent, then you have to pay him LOT, starter money. Keep in mind, Rodger Saffold went top of the 2nd round, I think we can find an athletic OT to play LOT in Joe D's scheme and execute well.

    Raiders drafted Jared Veldheer in 2010 in the 3rd in 2010, played at center in 2010, but then moved to LOT and is considered a top-15, 20 LOT. He was a a Division II player as well.
  11. Boltjolt
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    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    The Raiders OL isnt that good either and have nobody else to play LT. Vedheer only needed to beat out Mario Henderson who didnt make our team. Veldheer only played OC for one game in 2010 and then Samson Satale replaced him while he moved back to OT.

    Not that Veldheer isnt a good player but if they got a better LT they would probably move him to RT and replace the underachieving Khalif Barnes. Or just replace Barnes which would be easier.
  12. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I don't know about that.

    I agree the Raiders offensive line lacks depth, the reason why Veldheer is a starter at LOT, but he is a top-15 LOT in my eyes easily. In 32 games, 2011-2012, he's only allowed 8 sacks, 4 a season, split. Same exact numbers as Joe Thomas, least among full time LOT's.

    Now that's somebody I'd want protecting my QB's blindside.
  13. Boltjolt
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    Yeah is is but the rest of their OL isnt that great....though better than ours which is sad to say.

    Saffold has also missed 13 games the past two seasons.
  14. Bolts4lyfe
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    2 scenarios

    Round 1 (pick number 2)
    Eric Fisher OT Central Michigan

    Round 3
    Corey Lemonier OLB

    Round 4
    Jon Bostic ILB

    Round 5
    Earl Watford OG

    Round 6
    Kwame Geathers NT

    With the move to get up to pick number 2 SD had to give up their 11th, 45th and 221st

    Or

    Round 1
    Jonathan Cooper OG

    Round 2
    Terron Armstead OT

    Round 3
    Corey Lemonier OLB

    Round 4
    Jon Bostic ILB

    Round 5
    Nickell Roby CB

    Round 6
    Kwame Geathers NT

    Round 7
    Zeke Motta SS
  15. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    Not a fan of Corey Lemonier at all. Just plays stiff at times, and I don't know if he can make the transition to OLB in the NFL. Much rather have Jamie Collins or Trevardo Williams, both much more versatile.

    Also the 2nd scenario, I'd rather spend the 4th rounder on a RB if that's the case, take Gerald Hodges or kick Keith Pough inside for our ILB position. Kevin Reddick should be around too. No need for a corner or safety unless it's the 6th or 7th.
  16. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I agree on Collins at OLB, Just a bad situation we'd be in waiting until the 3rd or 4th for an OLB, Could still gamble on Brandon Jenkins. Who ever we get, I hope he's not like every other OLB on our roster 6'2" 260. I would like a 6'4" 250 Shaun Phillips build
  17. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    My 2 scenarios,
    1.)
    6. Eric Fisher OT*
    76. Joseph Randle RB
    110. Montori Hughes NT
    145. Gerald Hodges ILB
    179. Rodney Smith WR
    221. Quanterus Smith OLB
    *From Cleveland, swapped 1st rounders and also gave them our #45 overall pick.
    2.)
    11. Jonathan Cooper OG
    45. Terron Armstead OT
    76. John Jenkins NT
    110. Le'Veon Bell RB
    145. Gerald Hodges ILB
    179. Earl Watford OG
    221. Travis Johnson OLB

    I still think we trade down in both scenarios somewhere in the draft to gain additional picks, we'll need them to round out the roster. I think if we can draft 8-9 players that will give us something, in this draft, a lot of good players will drop.
  18. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    If the guy has good arm length what does 2" of height matter? Honestly, we're not going for pleasing aesthetics here, we're trying to put together the best possible football team.

    Von Miller is 6'3" and sub-240. James Harrison is 6'0" and barely over 240. Cameron Wake is generously listed at 6'3" (i.e. rounding up) and played at sub 250 lbs as a 3-4 OLB. If the man's primary responsibility is going to be rushing the passer then I care more about the attributes that aid him in that effort - which so long as he doesn't have exceedingly short arms (and even then there are techniques that can be taught) height isn't much a factor.
  19. Bolts4lyfe
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    I just think some lines have an easier time containing a shorter more stout guy which would be nice to have that tall lankier guy and vice versa. Although it doesn't matter, either you have talent or you don't but the guys you mentioned all have superior talent.
  20. Bolts4lyfe
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    Last week these all said Lane Johnson

    ESPN’s Mel Kiper, Jr.: OT Lane Johnson – Oklahoma
    What he says: “There's nothing more important for the Chargers than finding their future at left tackle. A good player who is only going to get better, Johnson can become the successor to Jared Gaither. Injuries along the offensive line have really diminished the offense over the past couple of seasons, and Philip Rivers[​IMG] has taken a step back because of it. Johnson, a former junior college quarterback, is a pretty gifted athlete for his size, and has been a star during the evaluation process.”
    ESPN’s Todd McShay: DT Star Lotulelei – Utah
    What he says: “San Diego is in desperate need of an offensive tackle, but there is no tackle on the board worth this pick. And with the Chargers' roster having become so watered down recently, they are in a position to simply draft the best players available. Lotulelei's ideal fit is as a 3-4 end, but he has the versatility to play nose tackle and increase the flexibility of the defensive front alongside Kendall Reyes[​IMG] and Corey Liuget[​IMG]. With his strong hands, nimble feet and range, Lotulelei brings plenty to the table.”
    NFL.com’s Akbar Gbajabiamila: S Kenny Vaccaro – Texas
    What he says: “The Chargers could use someone to complement Eric Weddle[​IMG] in the secondary. Vaccaro has an NFL bloodline -- his uncle, A.J. Johnson, played for San Diego in 1995 -- and he can bring a physical presence to this defense.”
    NFL.com’s Gil Brandt: CB Xavier Rhodes - Florida State
    What he says: “Rhodes is very good at press coverage, but he has work to do when it comes to playing off coverage. I talked to him recently; he recognizes that weakness and says he is working on correcting it.”
    CBSSports.com’s Rob Rang: OT Lane Johnson – Oklahoma
    What he says: “There are plenty of theories as to why Phillip Rivers hasn't played up to his previous standards in recent years. The biggest, literally and figuratively, might be the turnstile the Chargers have employed at left tackle since Marcus McNeill's abrupt retirement two years ago. Johnson, a former JUCO quarterback, defensive end and tight end, has grown into a standout tackle, who proved in his stellar play in the Big 12, at the Senior Bowl and combine workouts that he has the strength and athleticism to remain on the blindside.”


    CBSSports.com’s Dane Brugler: OG Chance Warmack – Alabama

    What he says: “The Chargers have questions at both tackle spots, but with the top three offensive tackle prospects off the board, they could focus on the interior, especially after losing Louis Vasquez in free agency. Warmack is a plug-and-play starter who will vastly help the Bolts' run game.”
    CBSSports.com’s Pat Kirwin: OLB Barkevious Mingo – LSU
    What he says: “The Chargers would have grabbed OT Lane Johnson if he was still on the board but he’s moving up these days. Mingo gives them a fine defensive end with OLB athletic skills.”
    CBSSports.com’s Pete Prisco: OLB Jarvis Jones – Georgia
    What he says: “The pass rush needs help and this kid made a ton of plays.”
    CBSSports.com’s Clark Judge: OG Jonathan Cooper – UNC
    What he says: “He might be the right fit for Tennessee, but if he slips he doesn't get past the Chargers. Now, more than ever, they need to protect Philip Rivers.”
    CBSSports.com’s Will Brinson: OG Jonathan Cooper – UNC
    What he says: “The Bolts might prefer one of the top tackles falling to this spot in order to protect Philip Rivers’ blindside, but they'll live with vastly improving the offensive line thanks to Cooper's athleticism and sneaky strength.”
    SBNation’s Dan Kadar: OT Lane Johnson – Oklahoma
    What he says: “Current left tackle Jared Gaither has played a grand total of nine games for the Chargers in two seasons. While the defensive line will be a possible target with this pick as well, Corey Liuget is quickly becoming a very good five technique and Cam Thomas[​IMG] is at least serviceable at nose tackle. The talent at offensive tackle drops off dramatically after Johnson is off the board, but there will be plenty of defensive line talent in the second and third rounds.”
    Fox Sports’ Peter Schrager: OG Chance Warmack - Alabama
    What he says: “Warmack — apparently named after the dog in the movie “Homeward Bound 2” — was a man amongst boys in college at Alabama. At just 6-foot-2, 317 pounds, he measured in a bit smaller than I expected at the Combine. He’s still a can’t-miss here, if you’re the Chargers. They’d likely rather have Fisher, Johnson, or Joeckel, but Warmack is a Day 1 starter, too. Watching film of Philip Rivers from a season ago, it’s amazing how little time he had in the pocket. I’d be surprised if San Diego didn’t address its offensive line with this pick.”
  21. The LBC
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    I trust Kirwan when it comes to evaluating pass-rushers and their ability to translate to the pro-level. That said, I've never really had a doubt that Mingo can be a productive pass-rusher as a pro, it's whether he will. My issues with Keke have always been personality and work ethic/drive related. I haven't seen enough to convince me that he's not someone who looks more likely to squander his athletic gifts (see Vernon Gholston) than use them to become great; I'd actually contend he's more of a classic boom-or-bust pick than Ansah is because Ansah's raw but has shown the willingness to commit himself truly improve.

    I think Chance Warmack is at the point now where he's overrated. Not saying he's not a very good player, but he's not the superman draftniks are making him out to be either. The difference between him and Cooper as pure guards is actually pretty negligible and should honest be decided by scheme fit for teams projecting both to fill a guard spot. Cooper's ability to play center should merit him higher consideration as center is a higher premium in terms of interior OL positions. Warmack also isn't a great pass-protector - really he's not, he's again very good but far from elite, he does get and has gotten beaten.

    Just saying, while he is most certainly a plug-and-play pro OG, any team that selects Warmack (with intentions of playing him as a RG) inside the Top 12-15 is reaching and overspending.
  22. Bolts4lyfe
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    Do you think he's strong enough? One thing that concerned me was when he declined to bench, then I went back and saw every single sack he had was from not being covered
  23. Bolts4lyfe
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    So assuming The top 3 LT's are gone:

    Star Loutlelei, Barkevious Mingo, Jonathan Cooper, Xavier Rhodes, Kenny Vacarro...........................................Who gets the nod

    And then when it comes to LT

    Menelik Watson, Justin Pugh (short arms I know), Terron Armstead, David Quessenberry...............................Who is the best prospect out of this group


    Personally I would try to trade down but staying patiently I'd still take Cooper

    As far as LT's I'd go Watson, Armstead, Quessenberry
  24. The LBC
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    There's this place called a weight room and these things called weights that allow a player to get stronger. All sarcasm aside, do I think his body can hold the weight? Yes. His frame can take more mass and unless he's got some massively tweaked metabolism or degenerative disorder, he can hold weight if he's willing to commit himself to a proper regimen. Like I said, it's not a matter of "can's" but a matter of "will" - which is really all on Keke, his resolve, and how committed he actually is to being great (versus just getting paid).

    Mingo is a project player, but we're not a team that's (realistically) going to be terribly competitive for the playoffs (or at least for the title) this year, so we have the luxury of investing in a project player if the upside is right and our coaches feel they can develop him accordingly. Then throw in that like 3-4 NT, Rush LB is a position that in most cases is a roughly one-year project position anyway - in that very, very few college athletes are able to step in straight from Day One and start at the position at the professional level.
  25. The LBC
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    For me it's a toss-up between Cooper and Star - this team flat out NEEDS one completely anti-AJ draft to get us on the right path... that being a trench-heavy class to build a solid foundation for both units. Star isn't an ideal 3-4 NT, but a front 3 of Liuget, Lotulelei, and Reyes gives us the kind of talent across that front that quite frankly you do (and can) design a scheme around - again it's a case of fitting the scheme to your talent, not the other way around (which was where Norv constantly shot himself in the foot over and over again). Star's the great pure value player at the position, and when positions of need are factored in the two are almost neck-and-neck (assuming that the team projects Cooper long-term as a center and not a guard - as a guard he doesn't have the value). You really can't go wrong with either in that scenario.
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  26. matilack
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    I think I'd take the cold shower with Cooper. As much as I don't believe in taking guards in the 1st at least it helps Rivers a little, and he can possibly eventually replace Hardwick who's time is almost up.

    Its hard for me to go Star because I do approve of the job Cam Thomas has done, and as much as I love the guy he has to develop into more of a 2 gap player and there is no guarantee there. And we are set at DEs with Reyes and Liuget, so if the guy is anything other than a "Star" NT it'll be a disappointment.

    I'm all over the place on Mingo, I wouldn't be surprised if he went 5th or 25th.

    2nd round obviously Armstead if he falls, which I highly doubt, which leaves us wide open for disaster on the O-line again in 2013.
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  27. Riff Raff
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    Couple of quick thoughts .... I like Cooper over Warmack. IMO, he's the more athletic of the 2 & I see this team moving towards a faster, more up-tempo pace. Not a knock on Warmack's ability or his future in the NFL. I just feel Cooper would be a better fit for where I think we're headed. At 11? Yeah, I could pull the trigger on him there.

    I'm not sold on Thomas as our starting NT. Has he improved vastly & shown a better commitment than I expected? Absolutely - but I still prefer him in a rotation. So yes - I could pull the trigger on Star at 11 as well, though I'd much prefer to see a guy like Jesse Williams fall to us in the 2nd. Hey - a guy can dream, right? ;)

    Really not sold on any of the pass rushers at 11. Maybe Jordan if he lasts until then, but I believe the draft is deep enough in this area that we can get a guy later.

    Honestly, the way it's beginning to look, I think the 3 tackles are gone by 11 & we either go OG or CB. IF we go CB (assuming Milliner is gone), I hope it's later than 11 & the guy is Trufant.
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  28. LT-Express
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    I guess a lot of it depends on how you feel Thomas did at the position. I for one feel like he showed enough improvement to not warrant taking a NT at 11, weather it's value or not. Do we need depth at the position? Sure we do, it is definitely a need, just not as pressing as the need on on the Oline. IMO, taking anything other than OL in the first weather we stay put, move up, or trade back for our guy will be a disaster. Rivers has been sacked 117 times, in the past 3 seasons, second most in that time span behind Rodgers (118). This team goes where PR takes them, and if we can't keep him upright we might as well mail in the season. Now am I saying that Star is, or will not be good/great player? Of course not. However, I feel that strongly enough about this OLine situation that if we don't address it with one of the top OT/OG this year we are in trouble.

    Me personally I am tired of taking second, and third tier OT/OG's in the draft and ending up watching us piss seasons away because our franchise player can't even take 4 steps before having someone in his face. Is all of Rivers struggles because of the this? No. But I do believe a vast majority of it is (see 2010 stats with a above average OL).
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  29. SuperCharger92
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    Well this I don't have a problem with necessarily.

    One, it's a new regime. Tom Telesco takes the draft very seriously, something AJ never really took seriously. Look at the list of players he interviewed at the Shrine Game, Senior Bowl, Combine, and also how many players are making visits, list goes on and on. So, they have an idea of who has value in the 2nd, 3rd rounds.

    We have a very good staff in SD. We finally have a guy who can lead a team, and also be the best teacher he can be for the younger players. You can also throw in one of the best in the business as an OL coach and Joe D. Knows what he has to do for these younger players, having spent a lot of time in the college ranks.
  30. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I was watching Path to the draft last night, and it seemed like the first segment was for us Charger fans, They were saying all 3 will most likely be gone but if LJ is still there SD will take him. Then they said a move up is not likely for a first year GM because they want to get as many of their guys in as possible, Daniel Jeremiah (who I like his opinion on players) said jokingly "Even if SD takes the 5th best LT in this draft, it'll still be better than what they have right now" which is true. In the end they had us taking Cooper

    Although I don't love the pick, I really like Coop and am planning on having him go to us, and hoping Johnson is there at 11.

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