Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Thumper, Jun 10, 2007.
You think Acee could have gotten the score of the game correct. What a dork.
RIP make a case for Parker being too expensive.
Right now VJ is suppose to be our Number One WR but is he really a Number One WR? He has not shown it in my book so where does that leave us ?
*Davis is suppose to be a Number One but we do not know.
*Floyd has the skills to be better than Parker but is not a Number One WR - maybe not for another season or two ....
*Osgood is in the wings .....
Are we mind screwing this to death ? :icon_shrug:
If you add Gates and LT in the pass patterns and with the mo-fo's that we have (Parker included), they should be able to get it done pretty damn good.
Hopefully, Davis emerges as a bonafide Numba One "go to" dude but is it really that much of a "do or die" proposition ?
I do not think so.
How many #4 WRs do you know that make 3-4 mil per?
Like i said, i dont see him as anything more than that, and expect him to drop there this year behind Floyd (has shown more potential to be a big time player than Parker ever has), Davis (who was #1 pick and was a guy AJ had ranked very high and said he had the best hands in the draft) and Vincent Jackson
You dont pay 3 mil a year to a WR who doesnt catch a single TD all season (he actually hasnt caught one since december of 05)
Also, let me ask you, what happened to the last $3mil #4 WR we had who didnt catch a TD all season?
Oh yeah, he got cut
He showed more than Parker ever did, and was a beast the final month of the season.
He had more TDs in december than Parker had over the past 2 seasons. If you take what he did the final 4 games (285 yards and 3 TDs) and stretch that out over a full season, that would be 1100+ yards and 12 TDs. Also, while he was breaking out, that freed up Gates to have his best month of the season
sure it was only 4 games, but those were the only 4 games he was really given a shot. I think he can easily keep that up for an entire season and put up something like 1100 yards 9-10 TDs
I dont expect him to ever be a #1, especially with Jackson here, but i do expect him to make a great #2 opposite him if he can beat out Davis who i think could beat him out with a good preseason.
Davis might never be a #1, but he is a perfect #2. Hes like a bigger, faster Parker with better hands.
If all 3 of those guys stay healthy, i dont see any way parker beats any of them out
Your whole arguement is basically "how many WR's do you see in the NFL who make $3 million per year and is a Number 4 WR at best ?"
You use the salary numbers in a very funny way to me. Example: You say "Eric is a $3 million dollar man per year" which is not correct. It is sort of misleading to a layperson because what a guy is paid and what is a cap hit are two different things plus what does the player bring to the table.
Eric Parker: signed a 1-year contarct in May 04 worth 380K- + contract was SUPERCEDED by 3-Year contract signed in July 04- + under new contract he receives an 820K signing bonus in 2004 and base salaries of 380K in 2004, 455K in 2005 and 545K in 2006- + he has the potential to earn 1.6M w/ escalators in 2006: 2006 salary will rise by 500K to 1.045M if he averages 50 catches over 2004 and 2005- + with bonuses he earned total salaries of: $1,204,300 in 2004- + 2006 salary rose to 1.045M by reaching escalators- + later signed 5-year EXTENSION thru 2010-2011 season worth potentially 13.5M that supersedes previous contract on 4/6/06- + he receives 6M guaranteed over first two years of extension including between 4M and 5M in roster and signing bonuses- + he receives base salaries of 700K in 2006, 800K in 2007, 1.85M in 2008, 2.225M in 2009 and 2.65M in 2010
Eric has been paid $6 million already.
His base salary for this year (2007) is $800k.
Next year, $1.85 million ....
The math is not quite as simple as saying Eric costs us $3 million per year because that is not correct.
Besides...Rip is assuming EP's a #4 receiver. Not on this team he isn't. He's at least our #2 until the other guys prove they're ready to move up on the depth chart.
Sorry Rip... VJ looked a lot better last year but even he needs to prove he will get it done over the long term. And he's WAY more of a sure bet than Floyd or Davis at this point. Maybe Parker should be a #3 or #4 but the guys behind him need to play their way in, and until they do it EP is going to continue to be a key part of this offense.
Another way to look at is I (the Chargers) already paid the mo-fo $6 million on a 5 year deal worth $13 million or about 50% in the first two years.
As a business owner, I want a freaking return on my investment and I may consider renegotiating Eric's contract IF he shows he is worthy.
It is all part of the game. Is Eric worthy ? I think he is big time and he is bummed he collected that jack and tanked on a play. I have never said he was Number One WR material either.
In the Coryell system, a Number One WR is really sort of silly since it uses the passing trees. The QB goes through his checks and progressions and hits the dude who is open. It is really that simple.
It is way nice to have the brother who can stretch the defense and I would prefer having a sure handed jack rabbit ala John Jefferson or Wes Chandler you bet but that rabbit may be in the lair as we speak.
Ok, fine how many 1.85m #4 Wrs are there?
#4s should be league min guys who are great special teams players.
Some may argue that he helps on special teams, but to me he isnt a good KR/PR. He doesnt have that great long range speed, vision, or shake ability to break it deep.
Cletis Gordan would prove everything parker could as a returner while playing for league min or we could draft a good kick returning WR next year to be the #4WR/KR
You dont waste almost 2 mil of cap space on a #4 WR, especially on a team that is going to need to free up money to sign Phillip Rivers, Merriman, Castillo and VJ to extensions in the next couple of years
Christ sakes dude.....
Look at it this way because I see you working it.
Is Parker worth a $1.85 million investment next year IF Davis and VJ get hurt or really do not pan out such as having a lousy year ?
Then ask yourself is Parker worth that money next year if VJ and Davis have marginal seasons this year ?
I think it is a hell of a deal to have a dude who could be asked to be a Number One or Number Two WR at $1.85 million.
You need to adjust your *** to the fact the salary cap has gone up as well which means these 3rd and 4th rated dudes get paid better jack.
Dude. $1.85 million is nothing under the current salary cap. It's like 1.7% of the overall number. It's a friggin bargain for a player with EP's level of experience. What else are you going to get with $1.85 million? Another Bawoh Jue type? C'mon now, don't act like EP is overpaid.
Well im not expecting them to fail, and thats why i said he would become expendable next season
He obviously isnt going to fall to #4 without those guys stepping up, but thats what im predicting happening. I see those 3 stepping up and TAKING the #2/3 spots.
So, no i dont think he worth almost 2mil if he does indeed fall to #4 next year, especially when consider that AJ has alot of big money extensions coming up
The team could easily bring in a rookie for league min to fill that #4 spot and return duties and save 1.5 mil in cap space
The only way EP drops to #4 is if all 3 (VJ, Floyd, Davis) live up to their potential, which would be very good for us because it would mean our WR corps would no longer be a weakness.
But the odds of that happening? Not very likely. At least not right away, it's possible (like what happened with our Oline) but it's being very optimistic about the other guys.
Parker will be the #2 until someone takes it from him, because I just don't see him giving it up.
Next season Parker is an insurance policy the way I see it and $1.85 million is not **** to pay for a dude these days.
I am not sure what big money extensions you are referencing because we have all our dudes locked up for quite a while. Nobody is a deal breaker next year unless you consider Drayton Florence a player who will break our bank?
I do not think so....
Eric Parker is proven and cheap insurance and gives it his all so the salary is not an issue.
I hope Bat Boy has a huge game gainst the Past!
Actually, i do consider Florence a big money extension.
Also, he is going to have to sign Igor (did he already sign an extension?) Rivers, Merriman, Castillo and VJ in the next couple of off seasons
regardless of what 'order' Parker/VJ/Davis/Floyd are in, the Chargers rotate their WRs in and out very well so they should all see some ample time on the field
Igor Olshansky: 6-Year deal thru 2009-2010 season worth 4.515M signed in July 2004- + he receives a 2.25M signing bonus and base salaries of 230K in 2004, 305K in 2005, 450K in 2006, 525K in 2007, 600K in 2008 and 675K in 2009- + the deal can be reduced to 5 years if he takes 15% of defensive snaps in 2004 or 30% of snaps between years 2 and 5 of his contract- + with bonuses he earned total salaries of: 2.565M in 2004 Agent: Leigh Steinberg
Philip Rivers: 6-Year worth 40.5M base thru 2010-2011 season signed in August 2004- + he receives 14.5M in signing and option bonuses- + receives 3.5M in intial bonus and first year salary, to make for 18M guaranteed- + can earn up to 10M in bonuses making contract worth 50.5M- + he received a 6.625M option bonus for 2010 by being roster on March 10, 2005- + he will make about 2.9M in 2005- + his base salaries are: 230K in 2004, 305K in 2005, 615K in 2006, 940K in 2007, 1.265M in 2008, 1.59M in 2009 and 1.915M in 2010- + with bonuses he earned total salaries of: 8.955M in 2004
Agent: Jimmy Sexton
Luis Castillo: Signed 5-year deal worth 4.664M guaranteed thru the 2009-2010 season on 7/26/05- + total value of the deal could potentially rise to 7.035M- + he receives a 1.38M signing bonus- + he receives a base salary of 230K in 2005- + he receives a 2.53M option bonus in March 2006 and a 524K roster bonus in 2005- + he can earn 3M in incentives over the life of the deal- + as part of the deal, his entire signing bonus and option bonus will be returned if he tests positive for steroids at any point during the life of the contract- + he receives base salaries of 230K in 2005, 310K in 2006, $498,500 in 2007, 687K in 2008 and $875,500 in 2009 Agents: Rick Smith and Michael McCartney
Shawne Merriman: signed 5-year deal thru 2009ha-2010 season worth a guaranteed 9M as part of a 11.33M deal on 8/1/05- + the total of the deal could be worth up to $15.73M- + he receives a 1.244M roster bonus very early in the deal rather than a signing bonus- + he receives a 6.35M option bonus that is payable over the 2nd, 3rd and 4th years of the deal- + the includes 4.4M in performance-based escalators- + he receives base salaries of 230K (1.406M in total compensation) in 2005, 310K in 2006, 680K in 2007, 1.05M in 2008 and 1.422M in 2009 Agent: Kevin Poston
Vincent Jackson: signed 5-year deal thru 2009-2010 season on 7/28/05- + he receives a 1.375M signing bonus and base salaries of 230K in 2005, 310K in 2006, 385K in 2007, 460K in 2008 and 545K in 2009 Agent: Neil Schwartz
The way I see this, the Chargers do not have to do **** contracturally unless one of these MO-FO's shows they are worthy of an extension. Note the dates.
How often does AJ wait til a players contract is up before signing them? The only guys i can think of are Brees (who i dont think he was ever going to give a long term deal to) and Deilman
AJ usually signs a player a year or two before their contract ends
Florence is better at his position than parker is at his
AJ signs a player a year or two before their contract ends IF they are worthy.
Merriman could end up testing positive again and **** could hit the fan.
The point I am trying to make is that these phuckers need to EARN it. Merriman is no LOCK to get an extension unless he performs CLEAN. The same goes for the rest of the gorillas otherwise - fuc them and go to the draft.
Florence has all the tools to be a very good #1 CB if only he had better hands. He was consistently in position to make the play, and while he didnt get the INT, he did get the breakups and was one of the top CBs in the NFL on 3rd downs.
If florence puts it all together this year, he will easily beat out Cromartie (who is all hype at this time) and next year demand TOP dollar as one of the top defensive FA in the entire league
Parker on the other hand would have trouble making half the teams in the NFL, and wouldnt be more than a #3 on the other half (except maybe the vikings where he would he would compete with Sidney Rice for the #1)
Osgood? We're talking WR's, not special teams players that suck in their listed position.
Plain and simple, EP choked. The thing that makes this point so accurate is that he came through for us all season. Hope he learns to leave it in the past cuz we cant have that again this year.
There are a couple of players you and I do not see eye to eye on.
1. Clinton Hart
2. Kassim Osgood.
Let me be as succinct as possible regarding your views and generally takes on these two Chargers players:
"You are full of ****"
Thank you (I miss Lord Monkey Butt from the UT).
That is all.
I gotz ta agree, Osgood is taking up a WR slot. He has stone hands.
Don't let snake oil salesmen such as Shamrock sell you the fact Kassim Osgood is NOT the ****.
I emplore the whole world to watch my boy Osgood and Hart.
Put them on the same plain as Rivers as the "Chosen Ones"
Let it be foretold....let it be written (or some **** like that)
Shakespeare ain't got **** on this forum.
As a side note: I sure notice a lot of "lurkers" or unregistered guests visiting the forums.
Show some balls and sign up and let us know what the fuc you think about what we post or the Chargers - ya dorks.
I thought it was all BS reading the dribble but after you jump in the fray, you are fuc-ked (hooked). Especially if your dumbass lives in San Diego. Tailgaters are a must.
That is all.
I think Kassim is the **** but that's on special teams
in regular WR situations outside of his blocking ability he's just ****
i like the guy I think he's great, but he's a ST gunner and that's all he will be.
As usual, you are short on the insight and short on the inseam.
You and Ray need Bong Hits to get your minds right on the PodCasts let alone player evals.
That is ALL.
Separate names with a comma.