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So, what's the board's general consensus of the coaching staff at this juncture?

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by HollywoodLeo, Nov 21, 2013.

  1. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    We can't start the token "Fire Norv" thread after some losses anymore, now. :roflmao:

    Having not been around the board a lot lately, are more people faulting the coaching/play calling or the lack of talent?

    While there's been some questionable play calls here and there (there always will be with coaches, it's just the matter of the extent of them) I'd lean closer to talent being the bigger issue holding us back....especially on the defensive side. I actually like Pagano but there's only so much he can do with this group.
  2. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    Everyone is being rational....just like they were being with Norv :roflmao:
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  3. Sandolf
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    Sandolf Blue Moon Rising

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    ABN still looks to be seeking his identity. The results are inconclusive at best.
  4. charger1993
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    charger1993 bad motherfucker

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    I give the coaching staff time to develop.like i do the wrs. 3 years. If you cant get it in 3 years. Im starting a fire blank page
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  5. Joy Division
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    Joy Division Slightly-known Member

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    Lack of talent--80%
    Coaches--20%
    as of today.
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  6. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    I tend to agree with this. I figured back in July we'd have no pass rush so the defense comes as no surprise, but I did expect our offense to be much better. Albeit we assumed Alexander and Floyd would be along for the ride, they would've been excellent redzone weapons.
  7. Blue Bolt
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    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Every first year coach makes mistakes....... the question is, will he learn from them?
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  8. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    ABN?

    I'm drawing a blank here.
  9. Blue Bolt
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    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Any Bunghole but Norv.
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  10. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    I've never seen the mistakes ABN has made from any first year coach. Anybody?
  11. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    Does it really matter how unique they are or are not so long as he learns from them?
  12. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    I think so
    "Mistakes" in this particular case are getting lumped with supposed mistakes that other coaches make as if it's all the same thing. Most often mistakes are things that no matter how seemingly bad, can still be argued. It is rare that they are unquestionable mistakes. Making a mistake on going for it, play calling, formation, philosophy, time-outs, ect. are not the same things as what McCoy has done in multiple games this year. They're up there with Marty running onto the field and drawing a 15 yard penalty--and NOT due to severity but due to how unforgivable making the mistake itself is.
  13. Lance19
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    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    That's what I hoped after the ugly Tennessee mess.

    But then McCoy defiantly stated that he would absolutely not learn, and promised to give us more of the same.

    I sincerely hoped he was lying (or just green beyond measure)…but then the Washington super-turd
    broke my spirit (you know, like as if it were on a medieval torture wheel) and convinced me that maybe he does
    believe what he says, and that for the first time in over 4 decades, I may need to turn away from my team.

    And again, after Travesty II (in just a half season!) McCoy basically answered his critics
    (namely every football viewer on the planet...who expects a TD with 1st and Goal on the 1/2 yard line)
    with: "Well, if the brain-dead plan had worked, people would've been happy, yes?"

    Any true Charger fan who isn't at least very concerned with the present leadership
    is either not paying attention…or has reasons to pretend they don't see what's happening.
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  14. Fouts
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    Fouts Well-Known Member

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    Same 'ol Chargers..... Some hope that Norv is gone..... That's about it for now, unless they somehow go on 6 game winning streak and make the playoffs. :confused:
  15. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    But....if you learn from mistakes that means you're not making them anymore.
  16. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    I've been out of the loop. Where did he say he wouldn't learn from mistakes?
  17. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    the types of mistakes he is making aren't the kind of thing that should happen to begin with...this guy isn't a pop warner head coach
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  18. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    But...if he learns from mistakes, regardless of how bad they are, that means he's not making them anymore.
  19. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    Just realized you responded to my other reply (learning from my mistakes :D)

    You didn't really answer the question, though. It was claimed that McCoy outright told fans he won't learn from mistakes.

    That seems like an awfully strange thing for somebody to tell the public so my guess is he made some comment that's being spun that way, but either way I'm curious what the actual quote and context are.
  20. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    Wait, after suffering through Norv for over a half a decade you're going to quit on the team after not even half a year under a new HC? :roflmao:

    (and that's not counting all the other insufferable years in those 4 decades.)
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  21. Lance19
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    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Obviously, he's smart enough to say he wants to learn from the mistakes, but his own words betray him:
    Read the parts in brown, and ask yourself if these are the words of a man who truly realizes his error,
    and plans on doing things differently next time.
    And this is just the Tennessee debacle…the Washington game was even worse.


    http://www.titansonline.com/news/ar...e-Quotes/6ce97029-4dfd-4f89-a091-4eff8f0d426e

    Titans-Chargers Postgame Quotes
    Posted Sep 22, 2013

    CHARGERS HEAD COACH MIKE McCOY(opening statement)

    In a football game like this too many mistakes at critical times during the game. This is a very good football team. We knew coming in here the style of football they play. It’s a tough place to play and a very physical football team. Give them credit. But when it comes down to the end of the game we didn’t make a play and they made one more play than we did. Give them the credit where it’s deserved. We were put in this situation and we didn’t finish the game so we have got to improve there. We let the quarterback make plays with his feet today and that was a big key coming into the game, don’t let (Jake) Locker get going with his feet. Unfortunately, we didn’t do that. Little mistakes killed us in this game. A number of them. We will analyze the film and look at it and correct it as soon as we can.

    (on not running as much in the 4th quarter)

    We were doing what we thought was best to win the football game and that’s what we are going to do. We are not going to second guess ourselves. We are going to learn from it, move on, and keep going. We got a first down in there like we wanted to do and did certain things. That was the plan we had and we went in with it.

    (on not throwing more)

    I am not going to second guess play calling or anything like that at all. We did a good job. We had a good plan. We have to do a better job as a whole. Whatever it is, we have got to do a better job and move on with it. We have got to eliminate the penalties, the dumb penalty in there, and one in the first half also. It’s mistakes and we killed ourselves. It’s a matter of us making mistakes at critical times. It hurts.

    (on conservative play calling)

    We did what we thought was best to win the game. If we make that play at the end of the game, there’s no questions asked right now.

    (on injury to T King Dunlap)

    I don’t know that because it was so late in the game and I don’t have all of the injuries in the game. It happened late, and so I’ll get an update after we’re done here.

    (on playing the game without key starters)

    Well, you know, we’ve got a good football team here. That’s why you’ve got 53 on the roster. It’s a great opportunity; I think the players that had an opportunity to step in today, they did a nice job, they really did. They came in with short notice because of what happened during the week and that’s all a part of the game. It’s an opportunity for those guys. We had every opportunity to win the football game with the guys who were playing, we just didn’t get it done at the end. We made too many mistakes throughout the game to put ourselves in a bad position.

    (on CB Crezdon Butler’s involvement in the second half and his preparation in short amount of time)

    Well, Johnny Patrick had a cramp there for a little bit, so he came out of the game. That’s when Crezdon went in. We’re not going to make any excuses. If he’s on our team, we coached him up as much as we could in a short amount of time. It’s all a part of the game.

    (on touchdown near the end of game)

    Touchdown. I’m not making any excuses. I’m not going to worry about a call, what they did, what they didn’t call. It was a touchdown – they won the game.

    (on LB Donald Butler’s active/inactive status at the beginning of game)

    Well, we thought he was going to be able to go. We thought all along he was going to be able play and then after doing a little more, he told us he did not think he could do it. So, we wanted to be smart with him also, you know, take care of him also. He went in there the one time, the goal line down there and certain things, but we have to look out for his best interest also. Certain things he couldn’t go 100 percent so we have to be careful. We played with the guys we played with. We tried to switch it (Tourek Williams), but we could not. It was too late to switch it. Unfortunately, we thought he was going to go the whole time. He came in afterwards, and so I guess, yes, the answer was a mistake on our part. Yes, we screwed it up.
  22. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    The only people suffering through Norv were the ones who wanted him to lose
  23. Lance19
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    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    I keep asking, but since you say you haven't been paying attention, maybe it's new to you…
    but I've asked repeatedly for examples of any of Norv's 99 games here, in which you can point to
    coaching foul-ups that so directly led to a Charger loss (not some abstract pooffery…direct cause-and-effect)
    as inexcusable as these two disasters from McCoy's first 8 games. I've had no takers (in a room of Norv-haters!)

    I admit, I wasn't as hysterical as those shouting "It can't get any worse!!" during the 58.3% winning of
    Norv's 6 years. Guess I was just cursed by memory of the decades preceding it.

    I can handle losing…I'm a Charger fan since 1969 (when I was practically a zygote) and didn't see my first
    playoff
    effort until my 11th season! (1979). So I don't need anyone to tell me about sucking it up.
    But the way the team of Whisenhunt & McCoy have turned wins into losses…and then said
    "Yep, that's what we're gonna do in the future!" makes the games harder to watch than the
    2-12 & 1-15 campaigns that I've endured. Learning from his mistakes? McCoy keeps saying
    "We don't second guess. We'll do the same thing again."
  24. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    What the Norv apologists don't want to acknowledge is that had we retained Norv, AJ (the man they like to blame for all our problems) would almost certainly still be here as well. So ultimately what happened was a win-win... Unfortunately we had to keep losing to get to that point.
  25. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    I acknowledge it and though Norv got a 13-3 out of an average roster and only one losing 7-9 season with a schit roster, he wasn't going anywhere with AJ and it was only getting worse. I'd get rid of Norv, Rivers, Gates, Mathews, Hardwick and 2 future 1st round picks if it meant getting rid of AJ.
  26. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    But it's not just Norv you've been through. There's Mike Riley, June Jones, Ryan freakin Leaf...

    It just blows my mind that anybody can sit through 4 decades of Chargers football and even for a split second consider quitting the team 6 months into a new regime because of a few bad calls and some pressers.
  27. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    For the record, I spent quite a bit of time arguing against the Norv detractors but forgot you weren't one of them.

    I was never a huge fan but I also wasn't on the scapegoat bandwagon. I was merely using him to make a point.

    But to answer the question, I do recall Norval running Sproles up the gut on 4th-and-game straight into Ray Lewis costing us a game a year or two ago.
  28. HEXEDBOLT
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    HEXEDBOLT Well-Known Member

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    Who???

    What was Chuck Nolls first season record with the Stillers????
  29. HollywoodLeo
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    HollywoodLeo Trevor Phillips Enterprises

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    I'm sure Chuck Noll and his staff never made any stupid calls during that 1 win season, though
  30. Burlington Bolt Brother
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    I'm not quitting the team and I dislike the owners, most the fans and the NFL in general. I agree that this team has been through bad but even the guys you mentioned didn't do stuff as innexcusable as McCoy or Marty.

    Lance is pointing to two huge things that though I agree with, I don't spend time arguing them because as bad as they seem to have been (I think they were horrible), they can be argued by those privy to the intelligence we can't access. The mistakes I am talking about aren't about directly leading to losses but about the fact they should never happen
    *losing a roster spot because your dog ate your homework
    *forgetting to have enough linemen on the active list
    *not calling a timeout with 20 seconds left in the half to force the opponent to punt in their territory--there is no danger of a muffed punt because you just rush 11 hoping for a block--u get the block, it's 3 points. So weak yeah, but it's the inexcusable stupidity that's the problem here

    As Lance pointed out, the two game losing fiascos were bad on their own but it's what he said that was inexcusable and made it to the list as well

    I like what Telesco has done (way more than Norv hate prevents most from liking), I'm excited about the team and never expected them to win more than 4. I just didn't think they were going to have what they have in an improved roster (especially at key spots) and wow, I really didn't think coaching would suck this bad and actually be the reason for losing. It sure as hell wasn't the reason for the losses the last few years. So weird that people will remember the Norv years as a bunch of losses.

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