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Two mock drafts where everything goes right

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by AnteaterCharger, Apr 4, 2011.

  1. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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  2. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    As of today, the only ILB on our roster who is for sure a Charger in 2011 is Donald Butler... In my opinion this is our biggest defensive issue.
    Cooper: Gone. Even he assumes as much.
    Burnett: Surely AJ will pursue a long term deal, but he's no lock to re-sign with us given the popularity of the 3-4 defense these days.
    Siler: Only given a 7th round tender, and lets face it he's a 2 down LB and goalline specialist anyway. Not a guy you want starting.
    Butler: Essensially a rookie, coming off a major injury on a lockout shortened pre-season with a new defensive coordinator. Not inspiring.

    I think Akeem Ayers should be a target if AJ is going to try to trade back into the 1st round. He is basically the 22yr old Shaun Phillips, he can play ILB, OLB, or even put his hand on the ground in sure passing situations. He's a far more instinctual player than a guy like Martez Wilson, and he's the vocal leader that we're missing on defense.

    I would be fine with Ayers at 18, I would be ecstatic if we moved around and got him later in the 1st.
     
  3. Boltjolt

    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    I dont want Ayers
     
  4. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Rather have Matthews or Wilson or foster or anyone but ayers
     
  5. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    What do you have against Ayers? Don't tell me you're writing off a good FOOTBALL player just because he didn't WOW at the combine. Would you even know Casey Matthews name if not for Clay Matthews? And Martez Wilson is nothing more than a workout warrior, infact there are a lot of scouts that question if the guy actually knows how to play football, or if he was one of those guys who rode his physical ability.


    "With excellent size and athleticism, Ayers could excel outside or inside in a 3-4 or 4-3 scheme if he proves to have adequate instincts at the next level." --Rob Rang

    At 6'3 255 he is an ideal fit for 3-4 ILB, where 40 time (4.81) won't matter as much because he won't be asked to cover sideline to sideline. Plus with his pass rush skills (most agree his best asset) he could easily slide outside......not to mention he is very much a vocal leader which we all agree is something we're missing.

    Watch this guy play and tell me he doesn't fit any scheme... he's #10.
     
  6. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Don't believe we need an ILB in the first round, instead if we are going to spend a first rounder on a LB it would have to be an OLB and I think OLB isn't as important as DE. We can find good OLBs and ILBs in the second round and later, the DEs are gone by the first round. Ayers is a decent player and I like him better to a degree then Aldon Smith. But I don't want him over Cameron Jordan or JJ Watt. Preference on position but if we got Ayers in the first I wouldn't be very upset unless we passed on a good DE to get him.

    What I don't like about Ayers; bites way too easily on fakes, instincts are poor, doesn't win one on one battles once tackles are locked onto him. Sounds a little like English
     
  7. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Reuter's isn't bad. I have my own issues with Watt, but then I also think that if the Pats pick naturally at #17 they're taking either an OL or Wilkerson (it's a prototype BB pick and Wilkerson is a bonafide 2-gapper which is an absolute must in the Pats' system), and Reed in the 2nd is good value and fits a need. Carter doesn't though... taking another early safety would basically signify that we aren't re-signing Weddle - I'm not advocating one way or another, I'm just saying don't tie our hands over a relatively average player whose collegiate program lineage with regard to putting out pro-caliber DB's is absolutely God awful. The prayer for logic would be that AJ would make a "justifiable reach" (for his personal value, not for actual value) and take Ijalana or Franklin there to play RT; as one of Kelvin Sheppard or Quan Sturdivant should last to our first 3rd round pick and if one goes off the board and he's feeling antsy he can package both 3rd's to move up and very likely recoup at minimum a 5th (which would still be picking before any other pick we had remaining came up).

    Rob Rang tends to project almost purely on need without taking into account front office tendencies. For example, Bill Belichick doesn't draft OLB's in the 1st round - every year people project him to do it because it's an obvious need and every year he proves them wrong. The only time he's ever taken a 1st round LB is when a guy fit his system like a glove (Mayo) and there really isn't anyone in this 1st round class that fits that mold (save for maybe Robert Quinn) because the Pats ask their OLB's to drop into coverage a fair amount. His draft for us isn't bad... his suppositions in his explanations sound like written masturbation; i.e. "like a moth to a flame, AJ Smith sees big, fast WR's and can't stay away" (when he's drafted all of 2 big, 'fast'... as a relative term WR's in his tenure... but then I suppose we can just lump in the ones he's signed as UDFA's to automatically mean that the guy will fall all over himself for any big, fast WR).
     
  8. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    That's what I like about Ayers though, he plays both OLB and ILB. He's an immediate starter for us at ILB, and capable of moving outside WHEN English gets injured again. I don't like the idea of entering this season with Burnett, and Butler starting with absolutely no depth behind them.

    Like I said I'm fine with Cameron Jordan at 18, but if we get the chance to trade up back into the 1st I think Ayers would be a great fit.
     
  9. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    BTW I just watched some tape on Greg Little, WR UNC. He reminds me a lot of Anquan Boldin. A big body WR, 40+ inch vert, clearly a max effort player, good blocker as well, A+++ hands...........but I don't love his long strides, I don't think he plays at the 4.50 speed his 40 time indicates, and he has some serious character issues.

    He's projected to go late 2nd early 3rd. He may be worth that 2b pick.
     
  10. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    He has had some character concerns, but he's one of the guys that it seems like actually "gets it" finally... unlike his UNC teammate Marvin Austin. He was quoted as saying that he was upset "to the point of tears" at not being able to play, particularly during the season opener and again in their bowl game, but felt that the punishment given was "earned" and "deserved."

    I'm less concerned with him being a long strider than I would be if he didn't have good initial burst off the line. Personally I could care less if the guy takes longer to get up to top speed so long as it's the middle gears that take longer to shift through versus his neutral to 1st to 2nd gear, so to speak.

    Another guy to take a look at, who is a sleeper but I think could sneak into (and is well worth) being a mid-to-late 3rd round selection is West Texas A&M's Stephen Burton. Nearly 6'2" (he's like 6'1 3/4"), 228 lbs (you typical big receiver if not overly tall), with very good hands and tremendous burst off the line (his 10-yard split is 1.54s, 9'9" broad jump) and a 35" vertical. Needs polish on his route-running, but that's typically been Joyer's forte when working with first-year guys. I've been following him pretty closely since he's a Long Beach Community College guy (and former track sprinter at LB Poly HS - which has been a perennial CIF contender for the last decade). He's also a capable returner.
     
  11. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Yeah VJack is a long strider and he's pretty darn good, but theres a difference between running a 40 at 4.5 and actually playing at 4.5. If I have to give the kid a knock its that he isn't very sudden in his movements, NFL corners could wear him like a blanket if he doesn't learn how to get more seperation.

    Maybe Charlie Joiner can teach this kid a thing or two and turn him into something special. I just hope we don't reach for Vincent Brown.
     
  12. Boltjolt

    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    I dont want Wilson either and word on Ayers is he isnt a real intense player. I havent seen where he is a real vocal leader at all but i think he is a good college player who wont translate well to the NFL.

    Agree on Casey Matthews. Getting too much hype and not a good fit for our defense imo. Too small and slow. i think 4th-5th round guy.
     
  13. Boltjolt

    Boltjolt Well-Known Member

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    Really like Little as a player but doubt AJ will draft him. But then, we arent in the interview room if he even interviewed him.
     
  14. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Honestly I'd rather roll the dice on Randall Cobb than Brown, and Cobb hasn't even convinced me that he can play the flanker or split-end positions as opposed to just the slot. But Cobb gives us a returner, a slot guy, and a gadget guy who can be pretty lethal in the screen game (if he costs a late 2nd though I'm not completely sure that's worth it, unless he can project to play the X or Z also).

    I'm also a big Tandon Doss supporter. He's not going to be a WR1... ever. But the guy has upper-tier WR2 potential, has phenomenal hands, and separates better than his timed speed indicates. Honestly, unless we lose both Vjax and Floyd to free agency, I really don't see WR as much of a need except for maybe a late round flier. We've enjoyed too much success with our previous formula - find the guys that have the burst to get good separation at the line and otherwise have good size just not great timed speed (and speed sells when it comes to WR's and the draft). There are a number of guys that fit that mold the very likely will still be around in rounds 6 and 7. To heck with In AJ I Trust... In JOINER I Trust!
     
  15. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Since your mentioning WRs what do you guys think of Jon Baldwin, don't think he'd be at our first or second picks in the second round I have to admit I think he'd be a great player in the mold of Malcolm Floyd/Patrick Crayton but Greg Little is just a little in front of him. Frankly top choice WR is Titus Young because that speed threat is something we were missing without Jackson.
     
  16. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Positives: He's a lot like Vincent Jackson. Size and speed, can make spectacular catches, good value in the mid 2nd round, runs most of the route tree.
    Negatives: He's a lot like Vincent Jackson....In that it could take him a while to become an NFL reciever. He's a bit sloppy rounding off routes in my opinion, he's not a great YAC guy at all because he's not that quick, I hear he's a little immature. I hope some dumbass team like the Redskins don't draft him and throw him to the wolves in year one. He's got lots of upside and the patient team will reap the rewards.


    Of the 2nd round recievers my list goes....
    1. Leonard Hankerson
    2. Greg Little
    3. Jon Baldwin
    4. Titus Young
    5. Randall Cobb
     
  17. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Pretty similar to my list, though again I don't think we draft a 2nd round WR unless it's an outstanding value (which means that other needs are really dried up in supply), except I have Tandon Doss ahead of Baldwin (hands, hands, hands; I can't say this enough!) and Cobb above Titus Young, because if you think that Baldwin has attitude/maturity issues then Titus Young makes him look like Adam Sandler.
     
  18. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Young: Only reason I like him is because he reminds me of DeSean Jackson. But I think you're right I'd rather have Cobb.

    Doss: I think he'd be a great fit in a West Coast offense, he's good finding soft spots in zones, has excellent hands, can take contact during the catch and hold on, and pretty good YAC. I just don't like his fit here with Norv.
     

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