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Where do you want us to end up?

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by LT-Express, Apr 17, 2013.

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What do you want SD to do with their #11 pick this year?

  1. Trade up and pay a kings ransom to get one of the big 3 OT's?

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  2. Stay put at #11 and possibly take Warmack, Cooper, or someone else?

    58.8%
  3. Trade down, gather picks, and take BPA at that slot?

    41.2%
  1. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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  2. ThunderHorse17
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    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    I'll be damned, but I fully agree. Thou I really hope we dont end up missing out on LT. I gotta think that we would forceable trade up above top 10 to SEAL the third best and LAST true plug and go LT in the draft in Lane. I would really love to be able to beleive that we can go to a better option at 11 and i HOPE that Warford is still there at 45.
  3. LT-Express
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    LT-Express Bolttalk.com Janitor since 06' Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Yes this is what I was thinking. An additional 2014 pick would have to be involved. Otherwise, I don't think it would be worth it to drop that far.
  4. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    One NFL scout told Packers beat writer Bob McGinn, "you just cannot take" Arkansas-Pine Bluff early in the draft.
    "Terron Armstead played at Arkansas-Pine Bluff, for God's sakes... There's no way," the scout said when discussing the possibility of selecting the athletic offensive lineman early. "There's less of a chance of a bust with him than the Watson kid," another scout said. "Athletically, he's as good as anybody at that position. He's in great shape, and he's serious about football." McGinn notes one team has reservations about Armstead's back.
  5. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    One NFL scout told Bob McGinn Oklahoma T Lane Johnson is "a fraud," when discussing the offensive lineman's play.
    "He can't run block," the scout added. "I don't think he plays strong. I don't think he moves guys." Two other scouts McGinn spoke with came away impressed with Johnson's natural power. "Built like a basketball player," another said. "He's got narrow hips, and those are the guys I usually don't like. But he has power. I don't know where he gets it from. I'm just amazed at what the guy is."
  6. MadMike
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    MadMike Well-Known Member

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    My draft board for day one would be:

    1 - If any of the big 3 LT's are here, draft them (All our looking like top 7 picks so at 11, great value)
    2 - If any of the big 2 OG's are here, draft them (Both are rated as top 5 talent in the draft, great value pick at 11)
    3 - If Milliner is still on the board (Unlikely), draft him (top 5 talent)
    4 - Trade back if you can, Vikings at 23 look ripe for a swap of 1's with a 2nd rounder and 5th rounder thrown in... (Could end up with a good Tackle, Guard, and CB by the end of the 2nd this way)
    5 - If you can't trade back, take Tavon Austin and force the hand of one of the teams that want him to trade with you a la Eli-Rivers
    6 - If we get stuck with Austin, we have an amazingly dynamic player who will help Rivers off the turf after every play and say "Did you see me? I was totally open!"
  7. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Thomas Dimitroff would be my favorite GM if he can somehow make a trade with one of these O LIne needy teams.

    CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora reports the Falcons are "high" on Oregon DE/LB Dion Jordan and Alabama CB Dee Milliner as they attempt to trade up in the draft.

    Jordan is a less realistic target -- he's a surefire top-four selection -- but Milliner definitely would make sense at a major need position in Atlanta. GM Thomas Dimitroff is believed to be targeting a large first-round trade up, potentially into the top five or ten picks. We suspect Milliner is the player he wants.
  8. Chico Andy
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    Chico Andy BoltTalker

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    To move down to # 30, I would think it might take ATl #1, #2 and next year's #1. That would be something to think about.

    Otherwise, I'm thinking the Rams as a better trading partner either their #16, 3rd and 4th rounders, or their #22 and 2nd round pick. Both scenarios come out pretty even on the trade chart. One of the guards may be still there at #16. As for who the Rams might target? Austin? Seems possible.
  9. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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  10. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I already like our OG play for this year. Again, we have a surplus of OG's, I think Joe D can groom atleast 4 capable starters for 2013 in Chad Rinehart, Johnnie Troutman, Steve Schilling, and Colin Baxter. There are also guys like Brandyn Dombrowski, Mike Harris, and Kevin Haslam who could all compete for the job.

    So, I think we're set at OG, for now. There still are a few vets out there we could also sign too.

    I think we draft at least 2 OT's in this draft, because that position is in shambles. I think we're making it worse than it actually is, I believe a lot of Rivers' downfall the last 2 years came with coaching, and specifically across the OL.
  11. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    3rd time today, I heard from a different source mentions the Chargers and DJ Fluker :confused: :cautious: :unsure::cry::oops::sick::poop: were my reactions

    [​IMG]
  12. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    There's just no way, not at 11.

    A guy that can ONLY play ROT. I don't mind Star Lotulelei, Arthur Brown, or a few others at 11 if we stay put.
  13. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I don't want Fluker in any round.
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  14. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    the worst mock draft I've ever seen,

    (1st) 11. DJ Fluker OT
    (2nd) 45. Blidi Wreh-Wilson CB
    (3rd) 76. Logan Ryan CB
    (4th) 110. Christine Michael RB
    (5th) 145. Oday Obushi OG
    (6th) 179. Josh Boyce WR
    (7th) 221. Tommy Bohanon FB

    I have a lot of confidence in our FO and coaching staff that it will look nothing like this.
  15. SuperCharger92
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    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    the best mock I've seen,

    (1st) 4. Eric Fisher OT
    (2nd) 45. Alex Okafor OLB
    (4th) 110. Joseph Randle RB
    (5th) 145. Kevin Reddick ILB
    (6th) 179. Nicholas Williams NT
    (7th) 221. Mychal Rivera TE

    Again, hard to see us trade up but it might happen, though I highly doubt it.
  16. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    It was Dielman, but for reasons different than the ones you're insinuating. Dielman was the lynchpin that held our OL together; McNeill was always so consistently even in the lineup past his rookie season. The situation with us is the same situation with Arizona in regards to the line, and yet people still seem to be overlooking basic fundamentals of the game because "it's draft season". Offensive lines succeed because of great play as a unit, not because of the great play of individuals. Joe Thomas is the best LOT in the game and has yet to see a single playoff game.

    I think we as fans have gone into a bit of a post-AJ frenzy and gone a bit overboard. Is it necessary that this team devote some premium resources to the OL and certainly more than AJ Smith was? Of course. Does that necessitate or justify reaching for players just to do that? Not if we don't want to be stupid about it. "Premium" picks and "more than AJ did" doesn't mean our 1st round pick has to be earmarked for an OL no matter what or that we have to trade up for one of the top three LOT's because none are likely to slip to us at #11. Look at our new OL coach's track record. In 2011 and 2012, Buffalo had the #5 and #4, respecitvely, yards per carry producing OL in the league, and a line that gave up the least sacks in the league in 2011 despite fielding as many as 11 different starters over the course of the season. Now here's a fun fact, the only 1st round pick they had on either of those lines was Eric Wood (selected 28th overall in 2008) who spent the second half of that 2011 season on IR.

    Our focus in building a proper OL should be in building the best unit, not the best collection of individuals. The willingness of people to resort to the Chicken Little mentality is darn near mind-numbing at this point.
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  17. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Again, F@#K the premium. What I am saying is Taking Warmack or Cooper are like taking one of the 2 top tackles.

    SAFE!!!!!!!!

    Who is a better/safer pick at 11?
    A top pass rusher who had 5 sacks, a DE who is learning the game of football or is it the CB who almost died last year? All 3 of those players are good and become elite, but give me an OG who I know can be very good.

    Sure we can find a Guard later in the draft, but we can also find an OLB, ILB, Safety, CB in later rounds that can be just as good as the guy taken in the first.

    I'd rather have Darius Slay/ Leon Mcfadden, Tevardo Williams/ Sio Moore/ Michael Buchanan, Kiko Alonso/ Jon Bostic, etc. over many of the "Top Prospects" on defense.

    But again that's my preference, not because "the Sky is falling" but because I like them over many of the other prospects.
  18. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Spending premium picks on "safe" players is needlessly wasteful. Sorry, it is. And Chance Warmack may easily never be an elite guard, his hype is being pretty well oversold. Is he a better prospect than DeCastro... maybe. As a pure RG in the right system, sure. But he's a pure RG (he's not a scheme diverse fit at LG because he doesn't pull particularly well) and he's, like a lot of Alabama prospects, pretty much already met his ceiling. That is a very real concern that has been echoing among the scouting community. This is the same thing I've been trying to remind people on Twitter of late, you're thinking like a fan... not like a GM/front office member.

    Drafting for need with no regard to premium will relegate us to a continued existence as exactly what we've been of late: Average. Also, I can't help but get the feeling that one of the main reasons you "like" so many of the later round options is because you've adopted and decided to remain completely stallwart to a Warmack or bust in the 1st round, OT in the 2nd round approach. Again... thinking like a fan, not like a front office member.
  19. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Yup, All in on Warmack, you caught me...............seeing how my Avatar is Cooper? And I never said OT in the 2nd.
    I do believe guys like Mingo and Jordan are better than Okafor, Moore, Williams *but I don't think they are in a different league* Which is why I'd rather have a 2nd tier 50/50 OLB in the 2nd or 3rd than to take a gamble on one of them in the first. The top 2 will be gone who's next? Werner, Jones, Carradine? Still too rich for my taste at 11 when 2 of them may be better as 4-3.

    Milliner scares the S@#t out of me, I don't care about the 5 surgeries, I think Saban makes CB's look better than they really are, He also showed how great his hands were at the Combine and before that has what 4 INT's in his college career? and thats the best player at the position?

    WR in the first? none too appealing

    No RB

    I'd love for us to get one of the 3 LT's but I don't think they are going to be there, not another one who I'd look at with the exception of possibly Long as a developmental project. But as long as were on developmental players I don't want one until at least the 4th-7th where guys like Nixon, Fragel can be projects.

    My thinking on Cooper? He will come in start, and contribute day one, has the upside to be a very very good player, would help in the run and pass game, fits into the type of system the offense is moving towards ( up tempo quick passing offense) will he be available if we traded back to 23? probably, but are there 23 players I'd rather have over him? No!

    3 OT's? yes

    any of the CB's? Hell no

    OLB/DE? Jordan, Mingo yes! Jones, Werner, Ansah, No No and NO

    Safety? NO! would take Vacarro but I think there are many of good SS that can be had later. Not to sound like a broken record but the franchise (I know it wasn't Telesco) just traded up and spent a high pick on Taylor last year, I'd rather see what a healthy BT can do before we attempt to block his position, I can easily see us bringing back a Corey Lynch until he's healthy.

    Any ways, with a day and a half before the draft I will be happy with who ever we take as long as his name isn't DJ Fluker. And me being a Fan and not a front office member who ever we do chose I'll assume the real front office people know a little more than You or I in what they want to do.
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  20. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    To further add to my previous post @ LBC this wasn't a jab, I respect you opinions, you know your S@#$

    I see all 3 OT's going in the top 10, Mingo, Jordan and Star following behind. From there I don't see anyone who is a better player than Cooper at any position, I just don't.

    It's like would you rather have the player who could possibly be as good as Andy Levitre or Manny Lawson?
  21. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    And to clarify, I'm fine with Cooper, not with Chance. Cooper offers much more versatility than Chance does and still has, IMO, yet to scratch his ceiling (which Chance has).

    All 3 OT's are going in the Top 10; I'd go so far as to say I'd bet money on it (but in a way I actually have considering I just sent in money for the competition aspect of the Mock Challenge on here). I don't mind Milliner as much as other folks seem to (the medicals are most concerning to me, I've seen the numbers, run the metrics, and then held them up against the tape - he's closer to the kind of athletic freak like Julio Jones that can still grow beyond Saban's scheme and development than he is Courtney Upshaw or Rolando McClain who were maxed out when they came out). However, my bigger reservation on Milliner is the same reservation I have on ANY CB, I don't think it's as important a position unless you're completely confident you're getting a Revis-type that can lockdown a receiver 90% of the plays and effective give you an pseudo "extra man" on the field by freeing up the safety to his side to do work elsewhere in the secondary. Otherwise, in the modern pass-heavy league, a top-rung safety is more important - particularly in a scheme like ours which uses a lot of zone looks. Any teams needs 3 good safeties, realistically to have the kind of defensive diversity to truly succeed, so I don't see drafting another safety as "replacing" Taylor... it might relegate him to more of a rotational or utility DB role when he comes back from injury, but even if that's all you get out of a 3rd round pick, that's pretty damn good by modern NFL standards. I realize "we traded up using a 6th round pick" but each draft has to be treated as its own separate entity; you can't let the emotions tied to the last draft (as a GM at least) tie you to a give more value than has been earned by a player - especially when you were the GM that made that trade up.
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  22. Bolts4lyfe
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    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I agree, I'm hopeful for Cooper but am 99.9 sure it's going to be Vacarro
  23. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    And I'm alright with Vaccaro more than I am most corners or even Warmack. There's still ceiling to Vaccaro and Texas has a fantastic pedigree for DB's as programs go. At the same time, as I said more than a month ago, I wouldn't be shocked if our interest in Vaccaro is double-edged: Yes, he does make sense for us, but if Dallas wants him (and indications are that both they and the Rams covet him) they may need to move up to #11 to get him because we're a threat to take him, as is Carolina and Miami could be a darkhorse as well.

    Another thing that was pointed out by the NFLosophy dude from Twitter-verse is not to read too much into the "___ (team) have interest in trading back (or have called around about doing so) or up," because EVERYONE makes calls just in doing their due-diligence to gauge what the cost would be so that they can plan accordingly. They want as much info as possible so as to make the most educated projections with regard to probability as they can. A "call" doesn't necessarily mean vehement interest one way or another... it's a call.
  24. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    I'm gonna be pissed either way if we take a guard at 11, but Warmack would be a flat out foolish pick...and it's not like I haven't been saying that for the last 3 months.

    I (like every other fan) hope we can trade back, and I think for the best chance of that that to happen it will require Tavon Austin to still be on the board at 11.
  25. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    Why are you sure its Vaccaro?
    Didn't we just draft Brandon Taylor last year?
    Didn't he have a good pre-season?
    Are we going to oust every rookie who gets injured just because he may not be ready for camp?

    I don't see much logic in Vaccaro, he's a good player but this draft is VERRRY deep in safety talent. If we go defense it had better be pass rusher, I'm far from confident that Melvin Ingram is going to be a double digit sack guy...and I know JJ won't be.
  26. The LBC
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    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Did he? I don't recall him being particularly memorable. And he didn't seem to do enough to get the coaching staff to put him among the game day actives until Week 13 when Bigby's injury forced the matter - not even as a S/T contributor - and even then he wasn't given the start until Week 17 when it purely appeared like it was speculative/"see what we've got".
  27. matilack
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    matilack #therealagent47

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    I thought he flashed some ability in pre-season, particularly in run defense, I was actually pretty excited about him long term as a guy who develops into a solid starter.

    I just don't see a reason to take safety at 11 in this draft to replace a player that I'm not even sure needs replacing (same goes with Star and Cam Thomas). Then you gotta consider the depth of the safety class this year, and the overall value of safeties in the 1st round (not unlike guards). Unless this guy is Ed Reed or Troy Polamalu the pick will not be worth it, and I don't see the speed or ball skills that those guys had.

    I'm not anti Vaccaro, I really like him, I just think his hype has begun to outstrip his actual value.

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