Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by rickochey, Nov 21, 2011.
yes, that is the guy to used to be the head coach for the Bills... and HE SUCKED TURKEY GIBLETS!!!
Just a thought..
We released Brees.. spends a few in NO and wins a Super Bowl..
Manning didn't come to SD and demanded a trade like a punk bitch.. goes on and beats the undefeated Pats in the Super Bowl..
so.. what are the Chargers missing?
A coach capable of leading a team to the Super Bowl?
I decent coach to back up our QB!
Brees had Payton in NO...Manning had Tom Coughlin...The Chargers have NORV TURNER..
A system tailor made for him and improved arm strength/accuracy orders of magnitude better then anything he did here?
A very lucky catch combined with the first extended time in his career he didn't throw the ball to the other team?
Can't imagine what else
this is easy.. A COACH WHO KEEPS HIS FOOT ON THE GAS... ALL OF OUR HC LET UP and got conservative. There is nothing conservative in winning a SB.
Right now it looks like AJ Smith will be back next year. My #1 coach(Cowher) to hire sure as hell won't come SD now even if it was slim before. So with that said we need to a Offensive/Defensive Coordinator who never was a HC or one who has a winning record/respectability as HC. The HC just needs to not listen to AJ long enough to take this team to a SB win.
I really just want a HC who can bring that Winning Aura/system that the Steelers/Saints/Packers/Patriots/Colts(of Old) have.
I can pretty much bet it will be 100% BS of a HC. It will be another 'REACH'
I know.. Norv Turner.. but Brees and Manning would had been here with Schotty..
But AnteatherCharger.. its not fair to say it was ALL luck.. Manning played great to get his team there.. He also made a defensiveness back door pass to Plax to win it.. Come on man no way.. yes Tyree's catch was luck but you can't say he won because of luck..
Okay.. so what does NO, NY; NE exactly do with Brees, Manning; Brady? They built a team around them.. Strong offensive line, decent and balanced running game, and they run schemes to get their receivers open! The Chargers show flashes of this but they don't get it done on 3rd and 3s,4s, and 5s, etc etc .. these teams figure out a way to go that by surrounding their QB with a very strong OL.. Weapons in the run game.. great receivers, and great/creativity on the routes of receivers..
I don't like bringing coaches out of retirement though.. Cowher, Fisher, Dungy, Gruden, etc. No coach who has been out of the game 2 years + has come back and won a super bowl..
There are a lot of coaches in the game right now we need to look at.. Winston Moss, Chuck Pagano, Rob Ryan and Mike Zimmer need to be looked at..
Vic Fangio - Not big on him just yet.. but great defensive minded coach..
How about Jim Tressel? Former Ohio State coach.. I'm not big on him either.. he's currently in Indianapolis as a "consultant"
On this side of the world, we're hearing that Fisher would be very interested.........but there is no way in hell that he'd work for AJ.
He had his clashes in Tennessee with a hands on GM (Floyd Reese.....who he eventually won a power play over and got so ugly that Reese's wife aired out Fisher's marital infidelity on radio) and owner (Bud "VY is MY guy" Adams).......he's not going right back into a situation like that.
Just throwing some defense-minded names out.
Take a look at the talent pool in buffalo while he was there too - I realize that for many it's en vogue to look no further than the HC as the root of all issues, but that isn't always the case.
BTW - as for my age, the year that I was born new cars looked like this ....
So blow me. I'm not the child typing in all caps.
On top of that, how many coaches can anyone think of that had success with one team, then went to a different team and had success? There may be one or 2, but I can't think of any
are you speaking as in terms of a head coach or coordinators/assistants?
I can think of PLENTY..
Sean Payton - QB coach in Dallas in 2003, coached Quincy Carter, Vinny Testaverde, and Drew Bledsoe to 3,000+ yard seasons.. Promoted to Assistant coach in 2005..
Bill Belicheck - Success under Parcells.. won 2 Super Bowls as DC on the Giants.. Appeared in another with the Patriots in '96 as well..
Mike Tomlin, Mike McCarhty, Tony Dungy, Andy Reid, etc
1. Winston Moss (Assist. Coach Packers)
2. Mel Tucker (Jaguars DC)
3. Pete Carmichael, Jr (Saints OC)
4. Rob Ryan (Cowboys DC)
5. Rob Chudzinski (Panthers OC - Former Charger Tight Ends Coach)
* These guys will get the job done.. And they would do exceptionally well.. we need more of a Defensive Minded coach.. but I don't mind explosive offenses this year and OCs who know how to flow an offense like Carmichael, Moss, and Chudzinski..
Mike Zimmer (Bengals DC), Chuck Pagano (Ravens DC) Vic Fangio (49ers DC) - All need more experience to me with their teams respectively..
Fire Norv at the end of the season please and thank you..
I am talking about guys who were Successful head coaches with one team (Like Cowher, Gruden, Fisher) then moved to another team and had success again.
Parcells failed in his 2nd job with Dallas, Ditka failed with New Orleans, Shannahan is a failure in Washington.
Yep, to be fair that Buffalo team had less talent than ours does, and Williams has probably developed as a coach since then. And he sure as hell isn't worse as a leader than Norv. On a slightly different subject, was reading a page back about people not wanting Cowher because it took him 13 years to win a superbowl. Point is, at least he has won one. Marty never did, and Norv never will.
Oh alright yes I got you..
Well it makes sense, guys like Parcells, built a Giants team, Ditka, built a Bears team, Cowher, built a Steelers team, Shannahan, built a Bronco's team, and so on and so on..
You look at those teams there.. they won Superbowls with a good/great offense but also did because of there bullying defenses.. thats what will win it in the NFL.. Defense
hmm... Random statement...
This is why I want a guy like Jeff Fisher - he hasn't won it all yet, and no one looked forward to playing against those physical Oilers/Titans teams he coached - after all is said & done, you may or not win the game but you would definitely know that you were in a fight.
The only issue here is, you can bring in a new coach but it won't make the players any better or nastier just by him being there. Some of the players either have to change their mentality or be replaced by more physical players.
Another thing, this organization has had a reputation for not looking at free agency like the rest of the league, and I am going to go out on a limb and say we are near the bottom of that pool. Somebody in the war room needs to step up and actively scout the better talent that's available and the organization needs to change it's policy and open the proverbial doors to try and get those types of players.
Explain how Jim Harbaugh has turned the 49ers around with pretty much the same roster. HC will do wonders to a team either good or bad.
Take them for what they are worth, its just another opinion...
MartyCaswell Marty Caswell
Norv on hot seat rumors "It's not difficult for me. I've been doing this for a long time. I get concerned it can affect people around me"
MartyCaswell Marty Caswell
Cowher always said he'd want to be amongst top-paid NFL coach if he returns. Belichick makes over $7 mil, Shanahan makes $7mil. Don't see it
MartyCaswell Marty Caswell
Regardless of rumors, don't see Chargers eating $12 million on Norv AND AJ & making Cowher amongst top-paid coaches.
MartyCaswell Marty Caswell
@DLocke619 I don't see Fisher for variety of reasons. He made $5.75 in Tenn. Norv about 3mil. Does $$ play a part? Yes
Probably the same way you can explain how the Chargers had one of the top rated defenses last year, and the DC goes to Carolina and we get Manusky who came from the Nyners (who had a pretty decent defense last year) and what do we have to show for it? We didn't change our personnel that much. Harbaugh to this point if you can follow my metaphor, is like Slim Pickens riding the bomb. He didn't make the bomb any better. He's just lucky to be on a team that has had very favorable outcomes, and is getting the credit for it. And don't forget, there is also the injury issue that has plagued this team in the worst way possible, whereas the Nyners have been relatively unscathed.
There's a good point I heard - in order to be on the hot seat one has to have a chance to keep their job
Unless there's a miracle worthy of the Torah, there's no chance Norv keeps his damn job. So there is no hot seat, there's a countdown to being fired. And regarding Fischer and Cowher, its touch and go as to whether they're even interested. But Spanos wasn't unwilling to pay big bucks for Schottenheimer AND prior to that offered to pay bill parcelles big bucks to run the team as well
What I don't get is this perception that the Spanos' are cheap.
No they aren't.
Anyone notice that Del Rio is available?!
Just as purely HC's:
1. Dick Vermeil
2. Bill Parcells (though he never won Super Bowls with the Jets or Cowboys he did assemble some pretty formidable sides)
3. One could make a case for Marty, in anything but the playoffs; same for Coughlin depending on how you rate his performance in Jacksonville
5. Holmgren (at least got to a SB with the Hawks after winning them with the Packers)
I mean, I'm not a huge fan of re-treads at all. Cowher's really the only one I'd be in favor of and that purely because even if we didn't get a Lombardi under him we'd get a much needed culture change that could set us up (with the right successor) for dynasty mode late in Rivers' career. Our guys are "soft"... with Cowher if they tried to "soft up" they wouldn't play.
I'd take him as DC in a heartbeat. HC, nope.
Well... there's a significant difference between the defense that Manusky calls (which he did as well with his heavy cushions, soft zone-coverage, and limited number of men actually rushing the passer in SF, not just here) and Fangio's which is much more disciplined and much more aggressive (which ironically is what Manusky was sold to us as). The Niners no longer play "bend but don't break" on defense, they play "break your effing back".
Additionally, the switch from Mike Singletary to Harbaugh is like night and day, and Singletary is the exact reason why just getting someone who is "fiery" and "puts guys in their place" is not the answer. Harbaugh is fiery, but he doesn't try to run the team like a concentration camp. He doesn't play the "you're going to do things my way or we're going to have words" card, he plays the "here's the way we're going to do things... right up front... don't like it? can't follow it? there's the door and in the mean time there's the bench" philosophy. It's not that complicated of a strategy; hell, my fraternity used to use it when I was in college: "Buy in or GTFO." That chance in mindset creates a paradigm shift that can finally get some guys over the hump - at least in a weak division, though going stride for stride with Baltimore's defense on Thanksgiving shows that they're more than just a product of a bad division.
So you are saying is that coaches are irrelevant. Adm Jim Harbaugh is just getting lucky. ..... wow... Can you than explain how he got 'lucky' at USD and Stanford?
Separate names with a comma.