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Best fits at OLB for the Chargers

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Blue Bolt, Apr 26, 2012.

  1. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Cosell: Upshaw, McClellin good fits for team's 3-4 defense

    There are different ways to evaluate an NFL Draft prospect.

    Some obsess over a player’s measurables — the 40-yard dashes and the bench presses, the broad jumps and the shuttle times, the height and the weight.

    Then there’s Greg Cosell.

    He watches game tape.

    The NFL analyst and NFL Films senior producer is among the most respected minds in the industry, studying more than 200 players off coach’s film to bring a fresh perspective to the pre-draft discourse.

    Recently, he agreed to talk Chargers.

    Specifically, if San Diego selects an outside pass rusher in the first round, which players, based purely on how they’ve performed on the field in college, does he see making a successful transition to outside linebacker in its 3-4 defense.

    Cosell, a nephew of sports broadcasting legend Howard Cosell, discussed South Carolina’s Melvin Ingram, USC’s Nick Perry, Alabama’s Courtney Upshaw, Syracuse’s Chandler Jones, Illinois’ Whitney Mercilus and Boise State’s Shea McClellin.

    Of the group, Ingram may be the first selected Thursday in the opening round of the draft.

    Cosell calls him a “tremendous athlete” who can play outside linebacker, bringing good “lateral agility and quickness, hand speed and closing burst” as a pass rusher.

    “He’s very light on his feet,” Cosell said. “He’s almost nimble. Not a word you’d usually use for a 264-pound man, but he really is. There are times when he ran and he chased, he almost looked like a running back.”

    While Ingram played several positions in college, Perry played strictly defensive end at USC in a four-man front.

    Cosell doesn’t consider Perry a natural fit as an outside linebacker in the Chargers’ 3-4 scheme.

    “I wouldn’t say he’s one of those dynamic edge rushers that could get low and bend the edge and blow by tackles,” Cosell said. “I thought he has good movement, but not explosive. He’s a guy who has the potential to develop into a good pass rusher in the NFL — he’s got some quickness to him. But not an explosive guy.”

    Draft analysts debate which position Upshaw projects to in the NFL — is he a defensive end or is he an outside linebacker?

    Cosell saw Upshaw as a 3-4 outside linebacker and compares him with Steelers linebacker LaMarr Woodley.

    “I liked Upshaw on film,” Cosell said. “He uses his hands really well. He has natural strength … I think he transitions well as a 3-4 outside linebacker who can rush the quarterback, who can play in space, too, and set the edge and defend the run.

    “Personally, I think he’d be a good fit for San Diego. I’m not sure he’ll be there at 18, but who knows?”

    Jones, at 6-feet-5 with long, 35 1/2-inch arms, is an interesting prospect.
    Cosell said he “really liked” him on film for his combination of length, size and movement, but he doesn’t “see him as a 3-4 outside linebacker at all.”

    “To me, I didn’t even think of him that way,” Cosell said. “He played defensive end at Syracuse. That’s what he is. Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe others see it that way. Maybe the Chargers see it that way. I wouldn’t even consider him as a 3-4 outside linebacker.”

    Mercilus, former defensive end at Illinois, led the nation with 16 sacks and nine forced fumbles last season.

    He’s another player Cosell “liked a lot,” adding he’s more explosive than Perry or Clemson’s Andre Branch.

    But Cosell doesn’t consider Mercilus a great fit for the Chargers.

    “I guess at the combine he did really well athletically,” Cosell said, “so I’m sure people think he can play 3-4 outside linebacker, and maybe he can. But I didn’t see that.”

    Cosell wrapped up with McClellin.

    He first watched film on the Boise State linebacker before the NFL Combine and says he saw similarities to Packers Pro Bowler Clay Matthews.

    “Boy, he’s one of those guys that’s deceptively explosive,” Cosell said. “He’s got really good lateral movement and change of direction. He has excellent balance and body control. He had great ability when he rushed on the inside to get skinny, which is a real knack.

    “He’s an outside linebacker in the NFL. Of all the guys we’ve talked about, I think McClellin is the purest of the group. Upshaw is too, but I think McClellin is the more versatile player.”
     
  2. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Up until yesterday, I was liking the idea of Barron or Decastro in the first and Shea in the second. Suddenly hes a known commodity to the 3-4 and hes gettin 1st round projections.... Dammit.
     
  3. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    I'm surprised to see Ingram falling in last minute mock drafts, if he slides all the way to the Chargers that would be hard to pass on
     
  4. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Exactly like with DeCastro. Would be hard to pass on a guy that is ranked best at his position in the draft.
     
  5. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    So now that its draft day, anyone regretting our meaningless wins now? Norv is still here, AJ is making the picks, and if we had just finished 5-11 or 6-10 we'd be in position to draft Mark Barron or Luke Kuechley without having to trade JACK ****.

    Don't want to start another argument, but nobody ever tell me again there was nothing to be gained by losing in that situation.
     
  6. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    There was nothing to be gained by losing..... eh you should figure it out some day. NOBODY likes or wants to lose. Losers labeled a loser are losers. You want to be know as a fan of a team full of Losers? Bad enuff were the masters of the choke. You prob would have said we choked if we did lose one of those games.
     
  7. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Huh?........ we were one win short of making the playoffs, but you think we'd've been better off losing more games? :rolleyes:
     
  8. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    For the future of the franchise, absolutely without a doubt.
     
  9. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Your scenario is based on after the fact revisionist history..... that's a dumb way to look at it. When you had a chance to still win the division, you don't hope for the team to lose games.
     
  10. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Oakland was a pointless win, we were out of the playoffs, so what's the point? Yeah it felt good to beat Oakland but they weren't going anywhere. I'm a firm believer that if you aren't going to win it all tank your season. Remember they don't hand out 4th place ribbons. look at Indy they kept losing to the point where fans were yelling for them to lose so they would get Luck.

    Anyways to my original point, when we get Smith (in a trade back) I'm just picturing all the corny headlines "Chargers finally get another safety Harrison" and stuff like that:D
     
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  11. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Please....... plenty of Charger fans base a successful season on how we do against the Raiders. Division games are never meaningless.

    I think Harrison is a lot more likely than Barron. With all the holes, trading up for a safety won't fix our defense.
     
  12. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    Again, and again, I have never said we should root for the Chargers to lose, and I never have rooted for them to lose.

    What I'm saying is have absolutely no respect for the thick headed clowns who say "there is nothing to be gained" by losing a game, because sometimes there is, and in our situation there absolutely was.
     
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  13. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    I'm not sure why we should care what joe schmoe who leaves his house with beer on his breath and meatball stains on his shirt to go pick up more jelly beans from Walmart considers a "successfull season". I think you and me can agree that 8-8 and no playoffs is not succesfull, regardless of if we split the games vs the Raiders.
     
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  14. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    Sure, we could've tanked the entire season like the Colts and gotten the #1 pick. :roflmao:
     
  15. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    Of course, there are no guarantees. You can think we'd be better off drafting higher, but that's not necessarily true. The draft is a crapshoot, and a big part of a team's success is predicated on luck. Some players get injured and never develop. So it's easy to say the Chargers would be better off drafting at 11, but it's not necessarily true.

    Obviously, sometimes there is something to be gained by losing. If the Rams ended up with pick #3 instead of pick #2, they never would have been able to rape the Skins in a trade.
     
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  16. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    I'm not sure Raiderhater would appreciate your characterization. :D
     
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  17. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    I think this is what Buck likes to call a "straw man" argument.:laugh:

    Whatever would have gotten Norv fired would have been benefited the franchise enough to satisfy me, and if you believe the rumors from Spanos just losing 1 more game would have been good enough. Lets just leave it at that.
     
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  18. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    The only team that can truthfully say their season was successful was the New York Giants, That year we went 14-2 was a fail, any year you don't go home with a "W" in a big game isn't successful. But I get what you're saying Blue, but that was more when we had a 19 game winning streak on them and we would use that to shut them up, granted you never want to lose to a division foe especially the Raiders but if it meant we get a better draft pick (look at the window of opportunity closing on us from KC,Den and yes OAK) they all had a life time sitting high with those draft picks Miller, Berry,McClain we always sat at 18 or above. they keep getting better we're staying the same unless we do something about it
     
  19. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    I agree completely, but now it sounds as if AJ wants to trade away more than 1 draft pick to jump forward in that crap shoot.
     
  20. Blue Bolt

    Blue Bolt Persona Non Grata

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    I would say the same about saying we'd have been better off losing more games. It's always easy to say that after the fact. At the time, we we're trying to win the division and get into the playoffs. The fact that it didn't work out that way doesn't change anything.

    You always hope for the team to succeed. The draft is too much of a crap shoot to say we'd truly better off my picking a few slots higher. There's no way to really know that. Clay Matthews was available late...... we passed on him. What's most important is how well your team evaluates talent.
     
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  21. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Isn't that pretty much true for almost every team, almost every season:
    that losing more games will yield better draft options?
    If you look at it THAT way, isn't there virtually always "something to be gained" by losing?
    (I still think I'll defend winning) btw Mat...your voice is deeper than I'd have guessed. Sounds wiser than your typing! ;)
     
  22. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Matty, if it weren't for straw man arguments, there'd be almost nothing to read on this site! :)
     
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  23. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    It isn't the meaningless WINS, it was the meaningless win against Oakland that cost us a possible coaching change and 4-5 slots in the draft. With that said, I can't really say that I was rooting for them to lose, but it would have been acceptable to me
     
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