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Does anybody else have concerns about Eric Weddle?

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Thread_Killer, Jul 26, 2007.

  1. Thread_Killer

    Thread_Killer Well-Known Member

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    First of all, I love what I’m hearing about Eric Weddle’s “intangibles”. Great work ethic, mature, intelligent, grounded, helps with special needs children, all good stuff.

    What I’m worried about is this: AJ and the coaches keep bringing up Weddle’s versatility, and Buddy Nix is on record as saying that this year, they expect him to back up both safety spots and possibly provide depth at CB.

    Is it possible that this is going to be Weddle’s role with the team in the long term as well? He might not be big enough to be a starting NFL strong safety, might not have the speed to start at FS. IMO, if Weddle isn’t starting for us at some point in 2008, then he won’t be worth giving up three draft picks for.

    Anyways, that’s my take. Weddle’s getting so much love from fans and local media, but I won’t be happy if he just turns out to be quality depth.

    PS. Yes, I’m aware that Weddle will bring in more fans to the message boards than our other rookies. But that is irrelevant. :)
     
  2. SanDiegoRon

    SanDiegoRon BoltTalker

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    .... just that it will be hard to sustain.... his walking on water.... :icon_rofl:
     
  3. 17Rocks

    17Rocks Well-Known Member

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    Consider this, depth at Cornerback, Safety and a possible nickleback/return man all wrapped up in one roster spot...

    The picks AJ used to get the guy would most likely end up as camp fodder anyway.

    I'm happy enough with the upside.
     
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  4. TBF

    TBF BoltTalker

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    Why worry now? Let the field tell us if he is too small, slow or not as versitile as we thought...

    I know a smallish , slow Safety from Torrey Pines that gives the Chargers an *** whoop'n everytime we play him... Weedle is very smart from all accounts...Smarts can make up for a ton on the football field...

    IMO Weedle is very John Lynchesqe... And, John Lynch succedds by being smarter then everyone else on the field... He not only knows his assignment, but it often times appears that he knows his opponents as well.

    Don't worry now, give it time and trust AJ...It's not like senor AJ has given us any reason to doubt him right?

    TBF
     
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  5. Thread_Killer

    Thread_Killer Well-Known Member

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    I know we should give the guy a chance, TBF. I just wanted to call my shot before Weddle takes the field. My expectation level is pretty high, given the price we paid for him.

    I’ll be rooting as hard as anyone for Weddle to eventually claim a starting safety spot and justify the trade. :tup:
     
  6. PolarBolt

    PolarBolt BoltTalker

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    He sounds like a stand up guy, ive got a feeling he was a gem pick.
     
  7. PowderLove

    PowderLove Former Mod, Current Slacker

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    Weddle can be the John Lynch we never had. Without the creepy last name.
     
  8. ESD Bolts

    ESD Bolts BoltTalker

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    Weddle is my least of worries... do you think AJ would give up all of those picks for depth at DB?
     
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  9. PowderLove

    PowderLove Former Mod, Current Slacker

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    Welcome to the broad, ESD Bolts. :yes:
     
  10. super_deluxe

    super_deluxe World Class

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    Yes, welcome!
     
  11. Buttmunch

    Buttmunch Well-Known Member

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    "Pedal to the Metal Weddle" will be just fine.....looking forward to having a hitter with instinct back there again.
     
  12. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    Weddle will be a safety long-term. His versatility is an asset. It's not a sign that he's too small to play safety.

    The nice thing about having Weddle at safety is that the defense can play against a three receiver set without getting out of their base defense. He can come down and cover a slot receiver. It's provides alot of options for the defensive playcallers.

    Weddle is almost identical in size to Ed Reed, and no one has ever considered moving him to safety.
     
  13. PowderLove

    PowderLove Former Mod, Current Slacker

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    If he's smart, he's AJ-ok in my book. :tup:
     
  14. ESD Bolts

    ESD Bolts BoltTalker

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    Thanks PowerLove and SuperDeluxe. Ive been creeping around in this board for a while but decided to make an account today. Go Chargers! :bolt:
     
  15. sdchrger

    sdchrger Well-Known Member

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    Welcome aboard. :tup:
     
  16. super_deluxe

    super_deluxe World Class

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    Creeping around....sounds mysterious...
     
  17. sdchrger

    sdchrger Well-Known Member

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    super_deluxe, quality of posts counts just as much as quantity of posts around here. :yes:
     
  18. Retired Catholic

    Retired Catholic BoltTalker

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    Versatility is another word for smarts governing physical ability. The guy is a football player with field awareness. Give me a guy like Weddle who knows how to play over an imposing physical specimen who gets confused when the ball is hiked every time . Given a choice I'll take the guy who knows where to stick his nose into the action and when to do it. The biggest part of success is showing up-where the ball is. That's just what Weddle does.
     
  19. Thread_Killer

    Thread_Killer Well-Known Member

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    I know that Ed Reed is around Weddle’s size. I also know that Reed plays Free Safety. My concern is Weddle’s ability to play Strong Safety in the NFL.

    I like versatility, but that is much less important to me than being NFL starting-caliber at one position.
     
  20. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    That's why I preferrred Weddle to Nelson. Nelson has the size and the speed, but his poor football intelligence limits the defensive scheme. Weddle's understanding of the game expands the playbook.
     
  21. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    I don't think Ed Reed is a true free safety. He plays in the box alot, like a strong safety. This was especially true of Reed's Defensvie MVP season. Usually, the box is a strong safety's domain.

    I think many people overstate the importance of the free/strong designation. In our defensive system, both safeties play both roles, depending on the coverage called and the pre-snap motion by the offense.
     
  22. turbo_turtle

    turbo_turtle In Disguise

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    I am not being sarcastic or anything here.

    I am trying to understand you TK about this. You would rather have a true Free Safety and or Strong Saftey instead of a player that could do both?

    Just my opinion here:

    I think that Weddle is going to give opposing teams offenses nightmares because of his versatility. He will be able to line up one play as a Free Safety and another as the Strong Safety to include plays at one of the CB positions. The opposing teams will not know how to game plan against him.

    I just love that we have him instead of another team that we would have to game plan against.
     
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  23. Chavez

    Chavez Well-Known Member

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    Probably just trying to give him opportunities to get on the field an make plays to have an early impact until he ultimately emerges as the starter.
     
  24. Shamrock

    Shamrock Well-Known Member

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    Versatility is important to AJ, Buddy Nix and Norv Turner.


    Link


    More ....

    The NFL is going more towards interchangeable safeties, to counter the complex offenses run by many teams. Interchangeable safeties help lower the predictability of the defense.

    I said before this draft that people need to get rid of the past conceptions of having a "centerfielder" and "intimidator" as safeties. If you are still thinking like that, you aren't paying attention to what this defense is all about, nor the trend with many teams in the NFL.

    A post I wrote before the draft:

    The Chargers rolled their coverage a TON. Depending on shift, motion and offensive personnel package, an intended cover-3 can now force either (or both) safety into zonal coverage in depth.

    Remember the blown 3rd quarter TD to Chad Johnson that was pegged on Cromartie? I still FIRMLY believe that was a blown "cloud" coverage by McCree. He didn't roll when Cro expected him to. Cro went to jam Chad on an off coverage within the five yards, then set up in a zone flat (cover 2 style). IMO, he was expecting either a straight 2 rotation by the safety, or a cloud rotation by the safety on that side. After the play, McCree went towards Cro and Cro waved him off, then Cro went towards D-Flo and they talked. By Cro's body language, either somebody else screwed up, or Cro wasn't given the last minute instruction for a swap of coverage (or he didn't hear it). I'd sure like to know the actual coverage, and who really blew that play. My gut says McCree is the culprit. If the guys who went to the SF game (and all those who attend in SD) remember how our coverages were when you had multiple WR sets to one side (total 3 WR sets). Primarily, Cro took the outside WR. Sometimes the Chargers treated it as Cro playing "man" on the WR, while the rest of the DB's played cover-3. Other times, Cro set up in the flat and the safeties did cover-4, with the inside WR being "man" by D-Flo. On third and long, it seemed like Wade called more Umbrella-4 (the whole DB backfield looked like a deep drop set cover-2 in the shape of an opened umbrella.)

    A good friend of mine, a Hart propenent, and a believer that he is a natural FS said this:
    That ignores the fact that a SS is going to get forced into deep coverage. Remember the Washington/Dallas MNF game two years ago, when Roy Williams got EXPOSED on back to back home run ball TD's? Then, teams went after Dallas repeatedly last season, with the full knowledge of Williams in depth coverage limitations. The fuggin' Panthers and Eaglets both ignored going after Rodney's weak *** wheels for 3/4's of those SB's vs the Pats, but finally started to attack the Pats safeties in depth - through the guise of scheme, and personnel - and were successful in the second half. Crappy players like Hart, Wilson, and boneheads like Josh Beckett get nailed in those situations.

    ..... "safeties split duties" .... When people say that, it gives the illusion that two guys are handling the job of a single player. That's absolutely not the case. Basic Cover-2 and 4 have safeties splitting the field into a zone that each are responsible for (cover-2 is deep outside - half of the field per safety while cover-4 is the "quarters" defense, with the four DB's splitting the deep field into four equal zonal shares.) To say "split duties" is a simplistic term that is not representative of the back 7 coverage. BTW: As much as the ignoramous segment out there wants to focus on the secondary as it relates to passing statistics, the true measure is defining a defense as a "front 7" and "back 7" - NOT a back 4, as most want to simplify it down. The LB coverage responsibilites directly relate to the coverage scheme of the secondary. ie ... a WOLB will cover one flat, while a SS covers the other flat in a cover-3 scheme.

    When Hart or Jue (and Wilson before them) have been in either C-2 or C-4, then they ALWAYS seem to be a step slow into the seams. McCree was better, but still not as good as we should expect. Jue hasn't been 100% healthy since he's been here, so maybe we just haven't seen what he can really give us, but I'm not holding my breath. I absolutely do not want to see Hart on the field, unless it's ST's or an emergency. I'm still confused on why Gregory was the #3 safety for the last 4-5 games, yet Hart and Jue saw action (while Gregory didn't play much or at all) during the playoff game.

    Predictability kills a defense. Wade was predictable in his defensive two minute drill, and in his third down play calling. Personnel limitations automatically CREATE predictability in a defense. When a QB knows what the defense will do, or knows the limitations of certain players, he will exploit those tendencies and weaknesses.

    If a defense fields two safeties that can play both SS and FS, then they can interchange responsibilites. Say both safeties line up at 8 yards deep. This gives a pre-snap read of cover-2, or maybe 4, depending on how the CB's line up (inward/outward shoulder side on WR, press at LOS, etc). Say the offense puts a TE in motion, to try and get the defense to give away their true coverage. If the true coverage (after the pre-snap camouflage) was Cover-3, then with personnel limitations, you would see the true SS go in motion with the TE, backing off the FS, and giving away the coverage to the QB. With safeties that can both run, cover (and hit like a SS) there is no need to flip the safeties based off the shift or motion. The disguise can still show 2 or 4 until after the ball is snapped. Now, the TE and WR's are running routes based off a pre-snap 2 or 4, yet the 3 coverage takes away the TE, and the QB has less time to process the new coverage information into his decision making process. Add in a post-snap protection change (based off an assumption that the SOLB was responsible for the flat coverage - and he's NOW blitzing) and if the RB didn't get over to that side - or the OL doesn't slide in the right direction - and BINGO, you have a coverage sack that's based off being UNPREDICTABLE because of having interchangeable safeties that aren't limited to FS or SS.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Some resource material for those who want to read up on coverages:

    Zone Coverage: Not as Simple as its Seams

    Topic list of Football 101 discussions pertaining to defensive coverages
     
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  25. Thumper

    Thumper WHS

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    I have seen this kid play and I'm not concerned about Weedle at all.
     
  26. RipTheJacker

    RipTheJacker Well-Known Member

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    The guy is too smart and didicated to fail, especially with considering he has already shown he has athletic ability and has been training as hard as he has this offseason

    I fully expect him to become the starter by midseason and provide an upgrade over kiel last year

    No worries from me
     
  27. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    Shammy, you are a freak--a bull castrating, truck driving, football genius.

    Your explanation of the coverage sack created by interchangeable safeties is just dead-on. Congrats on writing one of the most insightful paragraphs of football analysis I've read in years.

    Why can't the professional journalists write paragraphs like that? Instead, we get regurgitated Pablum about Randy Moss's "skills", or Eli Manning's "face."
     
  28. Thread_Killer

    Thread_Killer Well-Known Member

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    Top notch post as always, Shammy. If I quit my job I could read the whole thing, but what I did read is very informative. :lol:

    I'm starting to come around on this guy. Thanks to everyone for responding. :)
     
  29. Thread_Killer

    Thread_Killer Well-Known Member

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    :kisskiss:

    Wait, this post deserves more than one of these:

    :kisskiss:
     
  30. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    Go back to admiring your guitar playing or your guns. :lol: To quote some TV show (can't remember which one), "outside of a circus contortionist, you're the only guy i've ever known that could blow smoke up your own ***." :abq1:

    :lol:

    I'm sorry if the truth hurts. Shammy knows his ****, which is why he agrees with me. :icon_rofl:
     

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