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Free Fire Zone; Lets talk MG28

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Concudan, Oct 19, 2015.

  1. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    San Diego Chargers ‏@chargersbuzztap 9m9 minutes ago
    http://boltbeat.com >> Should the Chargers bench Melvin Gordon? http://buzztap.com/-y6nYRW

    So MG28; the kid received instant hate from many 'learned' SD fans when Telesco (cue ChainCrusher rant) traded up to get him.

    Since then he has been tentative in hitting holes. Often running into the backsides of the OL, and showing little vision for the bounce outs.

    That said, he has shown speed and strength as well. Often times carrying defenders for a few extra yards. And to play Devil's Advocate, it is hard to rush when you are getting hit in the backfield by defenders.

    So... Lets discuss this young player. Who hangs the 'bust' sign on him, and who expects greatness...

    Annnnnnd... GO!
     
  2. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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  3. LT-Express

    LT-Express Bolttalk.com Janitor since 06' Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Gordon will be fine. We are 6 games in too his career. We have the worst offensive line in football without question.

    It's hard to get any flow to a game when 3 out 4 downs you are getting disrupted in the backfield. It's sickening to watch our Oline get pushed 3 yards deep right off the snap on run plays.
     
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  4. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Not to nit pick... But it is just statistically untrue that we have the worst OL in the league.

    Currently the Chargers rank 27th.

    Teams ranking worse than the Chargers are, in descending order:
    49ers
    Titans
    Browns
    Chiefs
    and 32...
    Seahawks
     
  5. Savage Lizard

    Savage Lizard Charger fan at 7000'

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    Well then, I feel so much better.
     
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  6. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Did you not read that in sarcasm font? ;)
     
  7. Blitzy

    Blitzy Spanos Chargers Troll

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    The criticism of the Melvin Gordon draft was that although he was highly prolific as a colligate RB, that success came in a different system with a blocking FB and a run oriented OL, neither of which he has at his disposal with the Chargers.

    I am rooting for this kid and I want him to be successful. not only because he is a Charger and one I was particularly excited about (plus Verrettt), but also because he seems to be a very humble and good young man despite his woes growing up with a single mother.

    That said, I am certain by now that he has been mentally effected and that is worrisome because to coin a phrase from the great Yogi Berra, "football is 50% physical and 90% mental" ;)
     
  8. ChargerMike

    ChargerMike BoltBruthaFromAnuthMutha

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    Benched after two fumbles......welcome to the NFL, Melvin......Oliver make'n you look not so good.
     
  9. Blitzy

    Blitzy Spanos Chargers Troll

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    Brandon Oliver must be utilized more often because he was the last Chargers RB who rushed for 100+ yards games. Gordon must get his head straight and come help us after the Bye when we need him to man up. He has some growing up to do and must learn that he is no longer entitled to that starting RB position as he has used up that 1st draft pick "capital" which he had in his back pocket. He must now earn it.
     
  10. ChargerRay

    ChargerRay #FireMcCoy #FirePagano Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Poor run blocking, uncreative run plays. I blame coaching more for not putting him in a position to succeed. Call more edge runs and watch him go. Give him a lead blocker and watch him go. That's what good coaching staffs do, play to the players strengths. Gordon is not without fault though. The fumbles are inexcusable and he needs to improve in his pass blocking. But he's young and will adjust to the Pro game.
     
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  11. Montrose

    Montrose BoltTalker

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    Wow...hold the phone...we traded up to get him! Why didn't anyone say anything before now. I hope we didn't give away any draft picks to do so...now that'd be kee-ray-zeeee....

    :whistling:
     
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  12. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    [​IMG]

    LOL!
     
  13. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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  14. Lancer 1

    Lancer 1 Eternal Optimist

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    We've just completed Week 6. At this point in LT's rookie season, he had already fumbled 4 times, and the Chargers lost 3 of them. (sound familiar?)


    He would go on to fumble 4 more times in his rookie year, and the Chargers lost half of them - bottom line, rookie running backs will occasionally fumble. Great or even real good ones can eventually learn to lessen their frequency, ala Tomlinson or Tiki Barber.

    Melvin Gordon has alot of positives, and in the end I believe he'll turn out just fine for us. I like that he was forced to sit & watch yesterday, but we cannot punish him forever, and still expect him to become the competent & confident offensive weapon that we need him to be.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2015
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  15. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Very nice find Lancer1... I had forgotten that.
     
  16. Chaincrusher

    Chaincrusher BoltTalker

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    To be clear, I am fine with Gordon as a player. I think he carries first round value and is not a bust. I have three specific issues with how we handled the RB position.

    1. We already had another RB that carried first round value on the roster that we, in an act of sheer idiocy, chose not to keep in Ryan Mathews. There is zero doubt at all that Mathews is a better RB than Gordon is right now. None.

    Further, Gordon's potential does not seem to be substantially better than Mathews' potential. Mathews is a little faster and Gordon is bit shiftier, but other than that, the two RBs are pretty similar in terms of their physical gifts/attributes.

    In the hypocrisy department, I recall so many posters incorrectly being all over Mathews for fumble issues (even though he never lost more than two fumbles for us in any one season) and these same posters have nothing bad to say about Gordon even though he has already proven to be worse than Mathews ever was in that department, having already lost 3 fumbles this year.

    That said, it is not uncommon at all for young NFL RBs to have early ball security issues. Most RBs go on to correct those issues. However, Gordon did lose 6 fumbles in his final year at Wisconsin, which is a large number even for a player with a large number of rushing attempts. So, if Gordon does not improve, it cannot be said that we should not have been on notice about this issue. We should have been.

    2. We failed to re-sign Mathews and kept Donald Brown for more money. I think this was clearly done so that Telesco could save face and not have to admit yet another big contract personnel error as it came on the heels of the Cox and Butler contract blunders, so we were possibly approaching a critical mass in terms of big contract busts. But the correct move would have been to keep Mathews for less money than Brown and let the completely useless Brown go. That much is beyond any doubt.

    3. By getting rid of Mathews (making no attempt to re-sign him), we unnecessarily created a hole at the RB position in terms of not having anyone capable of being a legitimate #1 RB. Then, we did the absolutely unthinkable and traded away 3 picks to move up two spots (totally unnecessarily) to draft Gordon.

    Had we kept Mathews, we could have used a later pick to get a legitimate #2 RB and could have used our earlier picks to beef up the defense. Honestly, so far, I don't think there is any doubt at all that we would have better off going this way with our draft picks: 1--Bud Dupree, 2--Denzel Perryman, 3--Carl Davis, 4--Karlos Williams, 5--Kyle Emanuel, and 6--Darius Philon. Not only would we have had better players, but we would also still have our 5th round pick from next year.

    Had we done that this year, I think Mathews would have outperformed what Gordon has done (based upon Mathews' numbers as a Charger), we would have had a quality #2 RB in Karlos Williams (big and fast) instead of a loser 4th string RB in Brown, we would have added Dupree and Davis to the front 7, making us much bigger/stronger/better, and we would still have our 5th round pick from next year. In short, our team would be much, much better right now than it currently is.

    So, yeah, we totally screwed the RB position this offseason and missed out on a bunch of really good players in a feeble attempt to fix a problem that should have never existed.
     
  17. LT-Express

    LT-Express Bolttalk.com Janitor since 06' Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Regardless of what statistics say, we have the worst oline. Statistics do not show our Oline getting pushed into the backfield, and our QB making something out of nothing on a constant basis.
     
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  18. LT-Express

    LT-Express Bolttalk.com Janitor since 06' Staff Member Super Moderator

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    I for one was critical of Mathews fumbling and also am critical of Gordon's fumbling issues. However, my biggest problem with Mathews was always his inability to stay on the field. I am pretty sure he missed close to as many games than he played in SD. I haven't looked but I know he missed a lot.

    Fact people are basing their judgement on a kid who has played in 6 games, and has little to nothing work with on the oline. If you have played organized football at all, you know it is hard for a back or any other player to get any type of rhythm going when you aren't getting the work.

    I just need more time on the field from him before I pass a judgement of whether or not he is a boom, or bust.
     
  19. Chaincrusher

    Chaincrusher BoltTalker

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    Our OL was just as bad if not worse when we had Mathews and yet he still averaged over four yards per carry. Clearly, our OL sucks, but Gordon is also not playing that well in that he has been tentative and slow to diagnose his options, not all that effective as a ball carrier and has put the ball on the ground all too often. I think he will get better, but is he really ever going to be better than Ryan Mathews was for us?

    I don't see why we didn't just keep Mathews and use the heavy draft ammunition that we spent on Gordon to upgrade multiple other positions. I continue to see it as poor roster management by Telesco, just not smart at all. I don't think it would have taken a rocket scientist to have avoided this and some of the other colossal blunders made by Telesco.

    The frosting on the cake was that in a contract year, Mathews missed a record number of games for him, which artificially drove his cost as a player down. That created a textbook buy low situation for us. I always thought it was a good thing for a GM to get a good player for not a lot of money.
     
  20. LT-Express

    LT-Express Bolttalk.com Janitor since 06' Staff Member Super Moderator

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    Mathews rookie season we still had McNeil, Dielman, Hardwick, and Vasquez on the front. Compared to Dunlap, Hairston, Watt/Robinson, Fluker, Barksdale. It's not even close. Actually not even in the same vicinity.

    As far as why we didn't keep Mathews and dump Brown is beyond me. Not saying that their isn't evidence, but I have seen none that show we didn't try to offer him a deal, and I have seen none that show ge even wanted to stay here. That is all speculation.
     
  21. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    Gurley was my only 1st Rd rb I would have taken.

    Also because of Gordon having fumbles and 3000 rushing attempts.

    And I've seen Gurley catch plenty of passes. (In college) Still waitin on stl to realize he can catch passes too. Also I hated Gurley for 2 seasons then he kinda changed my mind with his brutal running style that was hard to stop.

    In short Gordon is a Charger and a young one at that. I will not hate or give up on him jus yet.
     
  22. Boltz_from_Oz

    Boltz_from_Oz BoltTalker

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    Just to add to this, its always mystified me that we go and draft a road grader lineman, and beef up the O-line...invest a high draft pick in Gordon...and then are pretty clueless in designing a running game that suits his talents. At this point in time we need to get him on the outside, not running up the middle. I think Frank Reich has little idea when it comes to forming a running game plan. As for the passing game plan? How much of that is really PR17 at the line of scrimmage?

    I also heard on a podcast last week that during training camp the O-line didn't even practice run blocking. Pretty sure it was this podcast here...

    http://www.boltsfromtheblue.com/201...fault-for-last-nights-san-diego-chargers-loss


    Melvin Gordons 25 yard run...is when he bounced it outside. Prior to his second fumble he spent a lot of time getting his ankle looked at and restrapped....then, on the second fumble...he took a shot to the head. It was a helmet to helmet hit.
     
  23. Fossil

    Fossil BoltTalker

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    This team's got some significant problems, MG28 is not among them. I predict breakout game against the 'turdz.
     
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  24. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 Winners Win

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    Check the draft forums, I was never, ever a Melvin Gordon fan. So when we picked him, I hated the pick. However, there is nothing you can do about it now. We had a need at RB, and we filled it.

    I will never kick a man while he's down, especially if he's on my team. I also stood by Ryan Mathews and his fumbling issues. Even though I didn't like Gordon in college, I've seen some flashes of what he can be, and it's something we haven't had in a while. I'll stand behind the kid, he'll get it done.
     
  25. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    I think the issue is that he's not being used well - he specializes in sweeps, counters, stuff where you can get him into space. I don't know why we got a running back like this when the team I guess wanted someone more in line with a Bell or a Lynch (or ironically a Mathews). The Chargers feel the need to just pound him up the gut and I don't know why they didn't both changing the scheme just a little to take advantage of Gordon's skill set.
     
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  26. Blitzy

    Blitzy Spanos Chargers Troll

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    Listening to the usually vanilla McCoy during his presser, it was not a certainty that Melvin Gordon would be starting for us vs the Raiders!
     
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  27. Lancer 1

    Lancer 1 Eternal Optimist

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    Even if he doesn't start, I'm pretty sure he'll play and will have a chance to redeem himself. If he gets rolling, then Reich had better keep feeding him the rock!
     
  28. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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  29. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    [​IMG]
     
  30. Pointyearedog

    Pointyearedog I only put idiots on ignore...

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    I was thinking that maybe on the plane ride home, coach told MG to hold onto a football for the entire flight home with the ball duct taped to his hands...
     

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