1. Welcome to San Diego Chargers NFL Football Podcast and Forum!

    Bolt Talk is one of the largest online communities for the San Diego Chargers. We host a regular Chargers podcast during the season. You are currently viewing our community forums as a guest user.

    Create an Account or

    Having an account grants you additional privileges, such as creating and participating in discussions. Furthermore, we hide most of the ads once you register as a member!
    Dismiss Notice

Looking ahead to 2011

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by MasterOfPuppets, Nov 9, 2010.

  1. MasterOfPuppets

    MasterOfPuppets Charger fan since 1979

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2006
    Messages:
    3,053
    Ratings:
    +636
    since it's the bye week and there's nothing interesting to post about...

    after 9 weeks I'm gonna say that the offense is fine and will be fine

    QB (check)
    TE (check)
    RBs (check, Mathews will be very good, Tolbert is also good)
    WR (check, even without VJ. Floyd, Nanee, Tutu and Crayton will be fine)
    OL (the starting five are decent, and Dombo, Green and Murck are good depth)

    so, in next year's draft I'd go all defense in the first 3 round (5 picks), maybe 2 OLB/DE to rush the QB, a safety and DE/DT depth, basically best defensive player available, throw in Donald Butler and we might have something there, fourth round: fastest mfer available, teach him to run back kicks, catch passes out of the backfield and that's it, fifth round on, OL depth to keep trumpy happy

    EDIT: Dombo would be the starting RT and Clary/that guy in the practice squad (Nick Richmond) would be the backup
     
  2. scratchnz

    scratchnz BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2009
    Messages:
    1,077
    Ratings:
    +91
    I don't agree that the OL is fine. There are still a few games to test this theory but I would say if they don't imporve, espicially in the run game, then they need to look at another Guard to throw into the mix. Dielmen has been a shadow of himself and Vasquez looks like he has regressed at times.

    A passing rushing linebacker will be TOP of the draft needs next year. Butler coming back will stregthen the inside linebacker core. If a good 3-4 End is available, I'm sure AJ would like to throw one into the current mix to strengthn depth and give extra competition. WR, FB and FS are also two positions that will be looked at.

    In Order of importance (currently)

    #1 Outside Linebacker
    #2 Wide Receiver (Floyd, Crayton, Nannee & Agiritoutou are good but they are not a true #1)
    #3 Right Guard
    #4 Fullback (Hester is gone)
    #5 Defensive End
    #6 Free Safety (Better depth and Competition is needed and someone that can also help of Special Teams)
    #7 Special Teams fodder (WR or CB kick Returner)
     
  3. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2006
    Messages:
    19,112
    Ratings:
    +2,931
    QB - Set in stone
    RB - Not ready to throw Mathews under the bus. Might need a third running back after Sproles leaves?
    FB - Would like an improvement here
    WR - Depends what we do. Floyd/Naane/Crayton are UDFA, Davis gone, Need to resign some of them to join Ajirotutu.
    OL - Get rid of Clary NOW, Dombrowski at RT. We seem set at OL but I don't know what to make of them yet.
     
  4. MasterOfPuppets

    MasterOfPuppets Charger fan since 1979

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2006
    Messages:
    3,053
    Ratings:
    +636
    this team doesn't use a FB, why draft one?
     
  5. !~BOLT~!

    !~BOLT~! Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    2,597
    Ratings:
    +205
    I'd be fine with the majority of d in the first five picks. I'd like some o line depth though. I also would like to avoid db's in the first three rounds, getting kind of tired of seeing us draft that position so high.
     
  6. MasterOfPuppets

    MasterOfPuppets Charger fan since 1979

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2006
    Messages:
    3,053
    Ratings:
    +636
    this team has a #1 reciever, his name is Gates

    I know most positions could use an upgrade (except QB and TE) but, with all of it's "issues", the offense is more than fine, a top flight defense would make this team unstopable
     
  7. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2006
    Messages:
    19,112
    Ratings:
    +2,931
    As far as I see it the top needs of the Chargers are

    1. DE
    2. WR
    3. OLB
    4. K
    5. CB/TE depth
    6. FB
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. bigmike.x.09

    bigmike.x.09 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2006
    Messages:
    3,493
    Ratings:
    +280
    Agree except for 2
     
  9. scratchnz

    scratchnz BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2009
    Messages:
    1,077
    Ratings:
    +91
    A #1 worthy wide reciever on the outside would make our offence unstoppable as Gates would get less attention than usual! ...and if he still gets heavy attention, than a #1 WR would make teams pay for it!!
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    10,930
    Ratings:
    +1,748
  11. gsxr

    gsxr BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2010
    Messages:
    141
    Ratings:
    +2
    Speed and meat. position is unimportant. get more depth. backups need more time with special teams. Oh yeah---special teams. Who's coming out of college that's worthy?
     
  12. JohnnyX

    JohnnyX 2017 Chargers Head Coach

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2010
    Messages:
    2,584
    Ratings:
    +378
    1. A New Head Coach....oopps...nevermind.
    2. S We need a real good safety along side with Weddle.
    3. OLB English is bust we need a Real High Caliber LB. No whiffs this time AJ.
    4. RB Matthews seems to be nearing the injury prone list. A extra RB will help on that.
    5. NT we need a big strong one. Nagata like.
     
  13. wrbanwal

    wrbanwal Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    9,707
    Ratings:
    +1,036
    Sign a f/a wide receiver. (I know it won't happen)

    pick up a monster offensive and defensive line player. (see Oher in Balt & Suh in Det)

    New SP teams coach.

    some fast mfrs to play ST

    and

    a new kicker

    thank you
     
  14. Trumpet_Man

    Trumpet_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    18,996
    Ratings:
    +654
    The only one with enough smarts.

    We need ..........

    Defensive End, Right Tackle, Center, Defensive End, Nose Tackle (Garay is 31 and Cam Thomas .... pffft), SWING TACKLE and not Dombo please, Offensive guard.

    All of the fans who are not on board with an all beef draft just ain't on board and shame on them. All of them.
     
  15. Trumpet_Man

    Trumpet_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    18,996
    Ratings:
    +654
    I fear it will take Rivers to get decapitated before fans get off their perches and see what this team needs and not what they want.

    C'mon man.

    C'mon people.

    Trenches win this thing. How many times does it need to be said ? How many times do we need to get embarassed in lack of run D or lack of rushing O ?

    Beef dammit. BEEF !!!!!!!!
     
  16. wrbanwal

    wrbanwal Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    9,707
    Ratings:
    +1,036
    replace both lines. right. good idea.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. Trumpet_Man

    Trumpet_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    18,996
    Ratings:
    +654
    Left tackle and left guard are fine. The rest is shiiittt.
     
  18. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    10,930
    Ratings:
    +1,748
    Replacing the D line is a must. Starting with that waste of money Castillo. Then the Oline starting @ RT and working your way in (I do like Vasquez tho). Clary and Hardwick need to go.
     
  19. Trumpet_Man

    Trumpet_Man Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    18,996
    Ratings:
    +654
    I give Vasquez another year and then he produces or off with his head.
     
  20. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    3,994
    Ratings:
    +1,394
    If the Pats (or even the Ravens, who have actually gotten the majority of their pressure from guys other than the once-touted on-par-with-Ware/Merriman Terrell Suggs of late) have shown us anything it's that in a 3-4 formation a high-caliber front 3 can make a mid-tier group of OLB's look great (kind of like how a great pass rush can make a mediocre secondary look fantastic). Guys like Jacques Cesaire simply don't get the job done - they show up for one to two games a year and otherwise just disappear. Travis Johnson could be a decent depth-signing moving forward but I haven't seen enough from him this season to justify giving him anything remotely close to starter's money or even a bonafide starter's spot.

    This draft is loaded up top with high quality guys that project well to play the 5-Technique: Adrian Clayborn, Allen Bailey, Nick Fairley, Cameron Jordan, Cameron Heyward, Marcel Dareus (though it would take a miracle for us to even sniff him), JJ Watt; and then there are a number of guys that are worthy of 3rd round investments based on upside, if requiring perhaps a bit more polish - mostly in terms of in the weight room - or have a few more questions than the guys up top: Christian Ballard, Cedric Thornton, Jarvis Jenkins, Lawrence Guy, and Jared Crick. I've seen enough from the two Antwans and Brandon Lang to believe that if we had a DE that was enough of an off-the-snap threat as to negate another teams ability to chip the OLB with a tackle and actually demands a double-team from start to stop, that those guys could be efficient pass rushers for us.

    VJ's as good as gone at WR. Floyd's injuries this season may be a blessing in disguise; the guy hasn't had the chance to put up the body of work that would allow him to demand Top 5-10 money or anything even really close. If we can get him signed to something similar to what Nate Burleson got this past offseason, that's a great thing. Naanee is an RFA (assuming the Restricted Free Agency rules don't chance from the previously settled CBA), Crayton is a UFA but he's also 32 IIRC... if he likes what he sees here he might elect to stay with Rivers in order to have an improved chance at a ring, Tutu will be under contract. I really don't see a reason to sink an early pick into a WR not named AJ Green. This whole offense is designed around not needing a pure #1 WR to succeed, it spreads the ball around a ton, not unlike what the Saints had been doing of late (and yes, their offense would function just fine if Colston was subbed with a different competent if "less uber-talented" WR). I also think AJ's been burned enough by the Buster Davis fiasco - and seen enough success from allowing Charlie Joyner to develop late round or UDFA guys like Floyd, Naanee, and Tutu - that he's been turned off to investing an early pick into a WR that isn't a Randy Moss/Calvin Johnson type. The earliest I'd expect us to look WR (and that's really only if we don't re-up Crayton in addition to losing VJ) is with the 2nd rounder we get from the Jets or else in the 3rd. I'd look for someone like Miami's Leonard Hankerson, UNC's Greg Little, Southern Miss's DeAndre Brown, or Iowa's Derrell Johnson-Koulianos as possibilities. But realistically I think we're more looking at someone like NC State's Jarvis Williams as a UDFA signing. I wouldn't be surprised to see us draft a TE before we would a WR (TE's a bigger contributors on S/T and Kris Wilson has fallen off terribly this season).

    Other things to consider, Green can't play RG (we've all seen him struggle) and he struggled at Center when asked to play there as he simply doesn't have the quick-twitch and reaction time to get the snap off and get into his block in time at the pro level. Mruck is a UFA and likely will be allowed to go the way of Jeremy Newberry. Now the team could look at Green as the eventual successor to Dielman at LG, but we still need at minimum depth behind Vasquez (and really I don't consider the draft pick invested in him to be high enough to not make him so expendable that he shouldn't be competing for his spot annually anyway if we can get a quality mauler in there). And then there's Hardwick - whose been injured in successive seasons and whose play has plateaued at best if not started to deteriorate. The center crop in this draft is extremely top-heavy for pure centers, though there are a few guys like Wisconsin's John Moffitt or TCU's Marcus Cannon who could foreseeably project to multiple OL positions. I'd like to see someone drafted that would at least push Hardwick, if not be a definitive successor to him when his contract runs up, and who can be a utility interior OL in the time being.

    For RT, I like Dombo and I like what he brings to the position. That said, he's a UDFA on a UDFA contract so it's not like we lose a whole lot if we invest a pick in a RT and the guy pans out better at the position than Dombrowski does. And there are plenty of guys in this draft that are having their praise sung as potential LT's, but I just don't see it. Guys like Carimi, Reynolds, Solder, and Love all have major flaws to their games (in many cases it's that they lack the natural knee-bend to allow them to attain the agility necessary to play the blind-side and maximize their athleticism) that make them project far better as RT's at the moment than LT's. You've also got guys like Marcus Cannon, Ben Iljalana of Nova, and Clint Boling of Georgia who are playing Guard (not so much Cannon, but Cannon is typically graded as a guard at the pro level) but have the tools to play RT.
     
  21. powayslugger

    powayslugger Feckless Slappy

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2006
    Messages:
    1,297
    Ratings:
    +276
    I'd like to see AJ hit a few solid hits in this draft... he's had some clinkers lately.. Buster, English, Butler come to mind. They aren't playing is what I mean. Add Matthews and his fumblitis and Hester's non-role to my list of question marks.

    AJ needs to get it somewhat right this off season. We're reaching the point we need some of his picks to start panning out... i.e. they need to become starters.
     
  22. MasterOfPuppets

    MasterOfPuppets Charger fan since 1979

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2006
    Messages:
    3,053
    Ratings:
    +636
    if you bring in Olinemen to replace Hardwick and Clary/Dombo, you could make this offense even better but it's still pretty damn good, one of the best in the league. The defense on the other hand is doing it with smoke and mirrors and I hate to think what a top flight offense will do to it, bringing in 6 high draft picks (5 1-3 rounders plus Butler) could make to defense be on par with the offense, I'd go OLB first, DE second and so on, but going best player available wouldn't be so bad either
     
  23. Old School SD Fan

    Old School SD Fan Unhappy Camper

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    279
    Ratings:
    +13

    They aren't and never have been under Smith in spite of LT making them look good when in his prime. We need to upgrade that OL or we'll be losing Rivers due to injury at points in the future and never will have a championship running game. As to whether or not the stubborn one in charge ever gets that through his head, well that's another story.

    Having said that, I concur defense is the main priority, we're far too weak in the front 7.
     
  24. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2010
    Messages:
    5,482
    Ratings:
    +629
    Totally agree. Bring in 2-3 undrafted free agents (all over 240lbs) and let them battle it out
     
  25. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2010
    Messages:
    5,482
    Ratings:
    +629
    We also need to ensure one or 2 of them are legit starters rather than just going for the high ceiling guys that take 2-3 years before they are capable of starting. And make sure they are guys that do NOT have injury issues
     
  26. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    3,994
    Ratings:
    +1,394
    I'm not sure what you mean by this. Th only OL we've drafted of late that had what could be considered "injury issues" as a prospect was McNiell with his spinal stenosis. Or are you saying that we should draft guys who aren't going to get injured? Because if it's the later, I'd sure like to know how you suggest the FO look into the future and determine who is going to get injured as a pro and who isn't?

    For the most part this franchise has passed on the guys that have previously had injury concerns. In 2009 Kraig Urbik was a substantially more polished Guard than Vasquez was, but Urbik also has a litany of a lower body (notably knee) injury history.

    I agree that injuries are happening at a higher rate than I'd prefer (it's really happening leaguewide, it's not so much isolated to San Diego) but you can't draft to AVOID that. You can draft to insure against the negative impact that those injuries have on your team, but the best way to prevent the injuries lies in the strength and conditioning training and sound fundamentals of game-technique.
     
  27. scratchnz

    scratchnz BoltTalker

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2009
    Messages:
    1,077
    Ratings:
    +91
    McNeil as had injury concerns since he started here...not only the spinal thing, but he played with his hands bandaged for ages didn't he?

    Also Hardwick has spent alot of time on the sidelines since hes been in San Diego.

    I have no major issues with our O-Line. Dielman needs to find the form of a few years ago as he has been average recently. Dombrowski has more upside than Clary and another year for Vasquez will do him wonders.

    I do want to see the back of Clary...and bring in some better quality competition and decent starting quality depth for Guard and Left Tackle
     
  28. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    3,994
    Ratings:
    +1,394
    McNiell broke both hands during his rookie season. It happens - typically not both hands in the same season, but it's not like it was the first time in the history of the league that it had ever happened. That said, his play was actually better when his hands were cast; he had less holding calls (because he really couldn't hold someone as easily as guys with functioning hands could) and he was forced to pummel and keep his hands actively moving and improving position on his assignment's body because he had less room for error in the event he got beaten or a guy got a step on him. At the other forum that I moderate for we had a running joke last year that someone ought to take a sledgehammer to MM's hands and break them again so that his (run) blocking would improve.

    My point is not that they've been injured. My point is that there is a distinct separation between "prospect" and "player". AJ and his staff scout and draft prospects, who then become NFL players. I point this out because as players guys like Hardwick, McNiell, Merriman, etc. have all had issues with staying healthy. As prospects they had no such history, and save from the normal wear and tear of college football, did not come into this league with any major concerns that they'd be injury prone hanging over their heads like a black cloud. It wasn't like this was some failure on the part of AJ, the scouting staff, or the training staff to identify medical or physical conditions that these guys possessed prior to becoming Chargers. It's the way the cookie crumbles sometimes; and really, as I previously pointed out, the keys to help lowering the risk of injury are a top-notch strength and conditioning program and the preaching of proper fundamentals & technique by coaches. That's on development... that's not AJ's job - he's acquisition and retention.

    The only true potential indicator for identifying a guy as injury prone (aside from poor technique, which is one that's correctable with coaching) or an injury-risk is prior injury history. We've drafted 3 guys since McNiell who had prior injury histories that were of any concern: Cromartie, Mathews, and Waters (and Byrd, whose injury was non-football related, then again until he became a Charger so was McNiell).

    My main point is that aside from looking at past injury history, which given some choice selections of one prospect over another when the opportunity was afforded AJ has shown he has done, it's unrealistic to say that we should hold it against the front office for drafting guys that have no prior injury history and get to the pros and then end up falling victim to a number of injuries... as though it was something that's correctable. If you've got another way of identifying the guys who are going to be injury-prone as pros from those that aren't, I'm sure there are 32 general managers (not to mention a slew of hopeful future GM's trying to get hired) that would love for you to share that information with them.
     
  29. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Don't like it, lump it!!!

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    14,284
    Ratings:
    +1,887
    Beef with a tude is a necessary need but a defense that play's to knock your arse out of the game is what will get the Lombardi.
     

Share This Page