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Merriman and Phil/Dan Patrick Show

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by LIGHTS-OUT, Dec 20, 2006.

  1. LIGHTS-OUT

    LIGHTS-OUT BoltTalker

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    I was listening to the Dan Patrick show on ESPN this morning. For one he said that Tom Brady is more valuable to the Pats in comparison to Phil for us due to the fact that we have Gates, LT, etc etc..using this logic he believes that Brady is more deserving to represent the AFC in the Pro Bowl. He went on to say that Shawne Merriman shouldn't be allowed to be in the pro-bowl because he tested postive for steriods and was suspended for 4 games.

    Thoughts?

    I guess I can see where he's coming from considering the Merriman issue-that can be debatable either way but I really think Phil deserves to be in.:bolt2:
     
  2. ChargersNguyen

    ChargersNguyen BoltTalker

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    I used to like Dan Patrick...
     
  3. exodus

    exodus Well-Known Member

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    well maybe Dan Patrick should put on a jersey and then maybe his opinion will count for something more than any other fans vote, but he can't, because he sucks, so to hell with ******** dan.

    And if Brady is so valuable to the pats, then they can make him their team mvp and patrick can orgasm all over it.
     
  4. ntman68

    ntman68 Well-Known Member

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    Honestly, I agree with him re: Rivers vs. Brady. I think Brady should have received the nod, as Phillip really hasn't had that great of a year. I am very proud of Phillip, to be sure, and am happy with his play this season, but nothing about it screamed to me "Pro-Bowl". Granted, Tom hasn't had that great of a year either, but I think he has been more solid and predictable overall.

    /ducks
     
  5. Thumper

    Thumper WHS

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    They have a thread about this at the UT forum also. The answer is easy though. Dan Patrick is a tool. :tdown:
     
  6. Thunderstruck

    Thunderstruck BoltTalker

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    That's his opinion and he's entitled to it.

    My opinion is that Tom Brady hasn't played like Tom Brady this year, and there are 5 or 6 other QB's you could say are deserving of being a pro-bowler if you're going to pro-rate their numbers to compensate for a mediocre supporting case. Heck, why not throw Aaron Brooks in there? He has played behind the worst offensive line in the history of organized football and has not yet been hospitalized. That alone should earn him a trip to Hawaii. You gotta ask yourself--if Tom Brady wasn't a three-time superbowl winner, and was just another young QB who had been developing in New England's system the last 7 years, would he get elected to a pro-bowl with his numbers?

    Regarding Merriman...whatever. I'm not going to get mad at people who don't like Merriman because I would probably feel the same way about a player on another team who tested positive. It's different when it's your guy...
     
  7. Thunderstruck

    Thunderstruck BoltTalker

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    Everyone's a tool if they say something negative about the Chargers, I guess.

    I like Dan Patrick. Since I don't feel like hating every single reporter in the country I figure I'll tolerate their opinions as long as they at least have some justification for their opinion. The guys I don't like are the ones who show some sort of consistent bias against the Bolts.
     
  8. exodus

    exodus Well-Known Member

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    Sure, why not. That's the exact same logic all these guys use when they're writing up their make believe articles and trying to get their soundbytes on espn.
     
  9. quickontoes

    quickontoes BoltTalker

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    I too, love Dan Patrick. I heard this earlier today and what I feel regarding Merriman is that he tested postive in summer training meaning he wasnt juiced during the season when he was sacking fools left and right. i think people just look at the time he was suspended vs. the time he was tested.
     
  10. boltssbbound

    boltssbbound Well-Known Member

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    You better duck offering that lame stuff about Philip.

    Philip has a better completion percentage, better passer rating, better TD %, lower INT %. Tom has 80 more yards, but it took him 40 more throws to get it. Philip's yards per completion and yards per attempt are higher than Tom's. Philip's three best games are better than Tom's three best. Tom's three worst are worse than Philip's three worst.

    Philip leads the league in third down passer rating and 4th quarter passer rating. Philip has a better passer rating when the game is close.

    Oh, and Philip's team is 12-2. Tom's team is 10-4.

    If you say, "Philip's team is better," that's fine. But Tom's team was better during his most successful years, too. If we are sending the QBs to the pro bowl who have done the most with the least, than the three AFC QBs would probably be Carr, Losman and Vince Young. But that's not what Pro Bowl voting is based on, nor has it ever been.

    Talking about the team surrounding the 2 QBs is an argument about who the better player is, but the Pro Bowl is about who is having the better year. And that's Philip hands down.
     
  11. boltsnow

    boltsnow BoltTalker

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    Well put!:tup:

    Even without the numbers to back up the STATs.....nicely laid out. Rivers will long be looked over because of LT.
     
  12. foober

    foober BoltTalker

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    These same media people that were blasting A.j. for what he's done the last few years just don't want to admit they were way wrong. So they have to find any little thing to take a shot at the chargers.

    The chargers are top dog now so jealous and envious media people will take shots at the chargers every chance they can. Probably gonna be like this for years.
     
  13. ntman68

    ntman68 Well-Known Member

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    I won't argue that Phillip's stats are better (though marginally so), and he certainly is playing on a stronger team, but I was always under the impression that the writers and whoever else votes (other than fans, of course), took the players importance to the team into account. To that end, I believe changing the Chargers QB would only slightly effect their season, whereas the Patriots without Brady would be doomed.
     
  14. Kwak

    Kwak ....

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    Comparing to Bonds is a joke.

    Merriman came clean. He admitted his mistake and owned up to it.

    Bonds still to this day, denies he took roids.

    • The leaked Grand Jury testimony contradicts that.
    • Blames it on Flax Seed oil :icon_rofl: :icon_rofl:
    • His best friend and personal trainer(Greg Anderson) is in Jail because he refuses to testify against his boy and Bonds is just letting him rot. (Because Bonds is going to slide him some serious jack when get gets out, if he didn't pay him off already)
    • He blew up like He-Man over the course of 2 years.
    • Went from a wirey singles hitter with speed, to a HR hitting monster.
    • His batting helmet size INCREASED.
    • And he is a complete A**H*** on a personal level.
     
  15. Alpenbolt

    Alpenbolt BoltTalker

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    Isn't it 33 TD's counting passes?
     
  16. Alpenbolt

    Alpenbolt BoltTalker

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    Merriman for sure is deserving. If there is no rule saying if you are suspended that you can't play then there is no way you can keep him out.

    Rivers and Brady were close but Philip delivered a better record. QB's are all about wins and Philip has led his team to victory. Totally deserves to go but couldn't argue if he was only the alternative either.
     
  17. Kwak

    Kwak ....

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    28 rush, 3 Rec, 3 Passing. 34.

    Edit: My mistake. Only 2 passing TDs, I thought he had 3.

    28 rush, 3 Rec, 2 Passing. 33.
     
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  18. ChargerRay

    ChargerRay #FireMcCoy #FirePagano Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Manning, Rivers and Brady should be in the Pro Bowl. Not Carson Palmer.
     
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  19. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    Dan Patrick is the best in the business, IMO. HOWEVER... He missed the mark with his assessment of Merriman/Rivers.

    I will email him and tell him that his mancrush on Brady has blinded him to the truth... while his mancrush on Leo DiCaprio has made him soft.

    Merriman has obviously done enough performance-wise to earn votes not only from the fans, but also from his peers.

    :helm3:
     
  20. foober

    foober BoltTalker

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    There isn't one fan or player or owner or coach that wouldn't want Merriman on their team.

    Rivers has played very well when he's had to. ONe big reason were 12-2.
     
  21. bigmike.x.09

    bigmike.x.09 Well-Known Member

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    look, if brady was the better qb and was truly deserving a starting spot in the pro bowl, he would have a better record than the bolts. however, i do know that the pats dont have a defense nor offense that are quite as potent as the bolts, buuuut, look at vick, vick has a crappy team and yet he is a phenomenal qb of the nfc.

    rivers has truly earned himself a spot, look at the stats, look at the standings
     
  22. Alpenbolt

    Alpenbolt BoltTalker

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    :icon_rofl: Nickelbolt, you crack me up.

    I met Dan Patrick last year at the Computer Electronic Show in Las Vegas. Great guy to hire to give a speech, he was hilarious. And my buddies and I had a chance to talk with him for about 20 minutes at the cocktail party afterward. The guy is one of the best in the business and a really genuine and nice guy. Very funny with a very quick wit. That guy gets a pass from me dogging on Merriman. At least he had a moral basis for his argument.
     
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  23. Thunderstruck

    Thunderstruck BoltTalker

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    If Brady was truly deserving of being in the Pro Bowl, he would be in the Pro Bowl. Seriously...it's not possible for Tom Brady to be "snubbed." He's friggin Tom Brady! He's got the inside-track to the Pro Bowl every year, so if he doesn't get in it means he's having an off-year and therefore doesn't deserve it!
     
  24. bigmike.x.09

    bigmike.x.09 Well-Known Member

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    yeah! what he said!
     
  25. matilack

    matilack Take A Knee McCree!!!

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    Thats why they call it the probowl, not the MVP. Rivers is more deserving of the probowl.
     
  26. TJBOLT

    TJBOLT Well-Known Member

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    I dont care what the none belivers think i jus know that our guy are pretty damm good

    :ABQ2: SAN DIEGO SUPER CHARGERS :ABQ1:
    WETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT
     
  27. BoltsFanUK

    BoltsFanUK Well-Known Member

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    Both of them deserve to be in because of the seasons they're both having:ABQ1: :ABQ2:
     
  28. Johnny Lightning

    Johnny Lightning Go Bolts

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    Word...
     
  29. PhilipRivers#1

    PhilipRivers#1 BoltTalker

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    Philip has had an outstanding year and these numbers prove it.

    I borrowed this from another poster known as Packman from another forum:

    First the total season numbers:

    Completion Percentage
    Rivers - 64.5%
    Brady - 60.5%
    Advantage: Rivers

    Passing Yards
    Rivers - 2879
    Brady - 2946
    Advantage: Brady (Although Brady has needed 47 more attempts to get those extra 67 yards)


    Yards Per Attempt
    Rivers - 7.52
    Brady - 6.85
    Advantage: Rivers

    Yards Per Completion
    Rivers - 11.66
    Brady - 11.33
    Advantage: Rivers

    Touchdowns
    Rivers - 18
    Brady - 20
    Advantage: Brady

    Interceptions
    Rivers - 6
    Brady - 12
    Advantage: Rivers (A huge difference-maker here, IMO)

    QB Rating
    Rivers - 96.3
    Brady - 84.9
    Advantage: Rivers


    Now let's look at some of the best/worst performance numbers:

    3 Best Games (As measured by QB Rating)
    Rivers - W/L: 3-0 - 68/98 - 69.4% - 951 Yds - 7 TD - 0 INT - 124.1 QB Rating
    Brady - W/L: 3-0 - 67/101 - 66.3% - 811 Yds - 10 TD - 1 INT - 119.7 QB Rating
    Advantage: Rivers
    (I did not include Rivers' first game against Oakland in this calculation even though his 133.9 rating was his second highest of the season because he only had 11 attempts in that game)

    3 Worst Games (As measured by QB Rating)
    Rivers - W/L: 1-2 - 52/96 - 54.2% - 544 Yds - 3 TD - 3 INT - 68.2 QB Rating
    Brady - W/L: 1-2 - 47/89 - 52.8% - 499 Yds - 1 TD - 5 INT - 49.8 QB Rating
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games Below 60% Completion Percentage
    Rivers - 4
    Brady - 7
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With 70% Or Higher Completion Percentage
    Rivers - 4
    Brady - 1
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With 300 Or More Yards Passing
    Rivers - 2
    Brady - 3
    Advantage: Brady

    Games With Less Than 200 Yards Passing
    Rivers - 4
    Brady - 5
    Advantage: Rivers

    50+ Yard Passes
    Rivers - 3
    Brady - 1
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With At Least 1 TD Pass
    Rivers - 11
    Brady - 10
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With Multiple TD Passes
    Rivers - 6
    Brady - 6
    Advantage: Even

    Games With No Interceptions
    Rivers - 8
    Brady - 5
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With Multiple Interceptions
    Rivers - 1
    Brady - 2
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With A QB Rating Below 80
    Rivers - 2
    Brady - 5
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With A QB Rating Below 90
    Rivers - 4
    Brady - 9
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With A QB Rating Of 100 Or Higher
    Rivers - 5
    Brady - 3
    Advantage: Rivers

    Games With A QB Rating Of 120 Or Higher
    Rivers - 3
    Brady - 1
    Advantage: Rivers


    One of Brady's noted qualities is how "clutch" he is in critical games/situations. Now let's compare Rivers' and Brady's QB Ratings in several "clutch" categories (and a couple of other key comparison categories):

    Situation-----------------------Rivers---------Brady--------Advantage
    4th Q: +/- 3 pts.---------------107.5---------105.4--------Rivers
    Last 2 Min. Of Half--------------102.8----------79.8--------Rivers
    2nd Half------------------------104.8----------83.2--------Rivers
    4th Qtr-------------------------122.0----------88.2--------Rivers
    3rd Down------------------------96.1----------73.8--------Rivers
    4th Down (Att)-----------------158.3 (5)------139.0 (7)----Rivers
    When Behind---------------------96.4----------69.3--------Rivers
    Opp 19-1 Ydline (Red Zone)------111.6---------104.9-------Rivers
    Against the Blitz-----------------132.2----------81.8-------Rivers
    vs. AFC--------------------------92.9----------76.3-------Rivers
    vs. NFC-------------------------113.6---------101.7-------Rivers


    Now let's look at the most important stat of all for any starting QB. This is something Brady's supporters often point to in his favor especially when compared with Peyton Manning - wins:

    Rivers - 11-2 ; AFC West Champions ; Current 1st Seed In AFC
    Brady - 9-4 ; 2 Game Lead In AFC East ; Current 4th Seed In AFC
    Advantage: Rivers

    Please note that all of this is not meant to suggest that Tom Brady is not a great quarterback - he obviously is. In fact many believe he's the best in the entire NFL and you can certianly make a strong case for him. And I know it's obvious that the Chargers have a better overall team with much better talent at the RB, TE and WR positions especially. But that still doesn't change the fact that a Pro Bowl invite is supposed to be about what you did on the field in 2006 and in looking at these comparisons, well...there really is no comparison. Rivers has been better than Brady at their respective bests, better than Brady at their worst, better in all the key "clutch" situations, better overall in almost every statistical way, and has his team with a better record and better playoff positioning.

    I don't see how Rivers could do much more to state his case. On a team where the RB is rushing for a record 26 TDs (so far), he's just not going to throw 35 TDs or for 4,500 yards. He's been excellent when his number has been called and even at his worst he's never really hurt the team badly with critical, repeated turnovers or major boneheaded plays. Things may change between the 2 this weekend, but looking at things as they are right now, in my opinion he clearly deserves the 3rd AFC QB Pro Bowl spot. Brady's past performance, Super Bowl rings, name recognition and reputation should not factor into this process for the 2006 Pro Bowl, but I'm afraid they will.
     
  30. Alpenbolt

    Alpenbolt BoltTalker

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    Man, Packman does his homework. Very nicely done. The numbers in this case don't lie. Philip is getting lei'd and deservedly so.
     

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