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mock draft

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by charger1993, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I did not, I hate Kiper and McShay. Both are clowns.

    But I wasn't big on Te'o. I didn't mind him, I actually liked the pick but at the time I was way higher on Kiko Alonso than I was on Te'o because he was more athletic. Kiko made a very nice impact his first year in the NFL with his athleticism. I know he's got guys like Marcell Dareus and Kyle Williams eating up blockers for him to make tackles, but overall he played very well against the pass and run. Te'o was pure garbage against the run, so was basically our entire defense.

    At OLB we need to get more athletic. Again, I stated before in the 3-4 Van Noy is strictly a SOLB. We already have Ingram who will replace JJ at that spot in the future. And with Freeney gone next year who is our pure pass rusher? You simply needs guys to get after the QB. That's not exactly Van Noy's game. Van Noy sets the edge very nicely and can dominate a game without a sack. He's got incredible football awareness as well.

    I would actually take Attaochu over Van Noy, whether its at 25 or 37, 57, etc. Only because of the things you've mentioned. Attaochu has so much upside coming in as young as he is and can learn from vets like JJ and Freeney for a year. He's got length, ATHLETICISM, and explosiveness. Incredible work ethic and has that hunger. He's improving in coverage and against the run though, but he won't be asked to come in and make an impact on 1st down to 3rd down. He will be a situational rusher like anyone else we draft because we have 3 OLB's ahead of him.
     
  2. MtlBoltsFan

    MtlBoltsFan Jesse Ventura/Howard Stern 2016

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    I wouldn't place limitations on Van Noy or Attaochu........ Van Noy lined up all over the field and Attaochu has lined up strongside, weakside.... it doesn't matter. Same with Ingram, versatile enough to play SOLB, WOLB. Johnson on the other hand is strictly a strongside guy who thrives at setting the edge and gap containment.

    Van Noy obviously isn't a traditional pass rusher for a rush linebacker but his ability to get into the backfield no matter where he lines up is undeniable. He uses his hands and feet well enough to outmaneuver linemen and push upfield and knifes through traffic like a boss and has some untapped ability there.

    Regardless, thinking about it more it's unlikely the Chargers select either at 25. Ingram has one spot locked down and there is tons of competition for the other spot. If we do take one of them there it will truly be a case of the Chargers thinking they have a special player and going total BPA. It seems pretty clear they might be looking at either guy falling to 57 or whether it's worth moving up in the 2nd to grab either one.
     
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  3. MtlBoltsFan

    MtlBoltsFan Jesse Ventura/Howard Stern 2016

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    my buddy leisure prophesized long ago that the chargers would build a team of mormons and that would be their downfall...... it only makes sense they want to add van noy to play next to teo and weddle and were targeting star lotulelei last year. they even let go of clipboard jesus to mormonize the QB position.

    dean is a closet white supremacist who abandoned the church of scientology years ago to join the church of latter day saints and is trying to assemble a super team of white and polenesian mormon football players. the only reason they drafted fluker was because he is going to get michael jackson vitiligo disease by age 27
     
  4. Duffman57

    Duffman57 BoltTalker

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    I wouldn't mind Van Noy, but he's really similar to what we already have in Ingram. A guy that just naturally gets into the backfield, but isn't necessarily going to be a consistent threat as a pass rush. If we needed a guy who was more of a Sam OLB, then i would have no qualms at all taking Van Noy.

    We do have competition for the other starting spot oppo Ingram, but Freeney/Johnson are on the last years of their deals and are really old (probably both are close to done after this season, and almost for sure done with the Chargers IMO). At the Rush LB spot, there's a lot of benefits to easing into a transition from college to a full time role. Similar to what the Pats did with Jones, Seahawks did with Irvin, SF did with Aldon etc etc, I want to draft a guy higher up this year to come in as a pass rush specialist, and develop him into a starter next year at the Rush LB position, or ROLB i guess if you want to call it that. Especially with Attaochu's character and work ethic that TT and McCoy have liked in guys that we've drafted so far, i could see him being the pick.
     
  5. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    It's about time somebody told the truth about this…connect the dots, sheeple!!
     
  6. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Van Noy is a terrible rush linebacker prospect. He's not explosive, nor is he flexible. So he lacks the ability to bend around the tackle, but he can't compensate for that with first step quickness. Most of the time he's matched up on an OT, he's playing patty cake trying to juke past him with that little jump cut thing he does. Or occasionally he'll bull rush, which won't translate to the NFL in his case. His timing, understanding of angles, and instincts make him a good blitzer, so he'd be best served as a 4-3 SOLB who is sent after the QB on occasion. Any team that expects consistent pass rush out of him will be disappointed.

    In any case, the moves we've made this offseason suggest to me that they aren't going to be too aggressive about taking a pass rusher high in this class. Which is fine, because Ealy is the only one I really like at #25 and I don't think he'll be there realistically. They've kept English and restructured to keep JJ and Freeney as well. They're getting Ingram back, and have brought Law into the mix with Williams and Keiser. I'd like more help than that, but it seems that they might be content to roll with 5 out of that mix if value doesn't fall to one of their picks.
     
  7. MtlBoltsFan

    MtlBoltsFan Jesse Ventura/Howard Stern 2016

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    What the **** are you talking about? Van Noy is not a terrible rush linebacker prospect, he's just a better 4-3 OLB prospect and could even make for an effective ILB in certain schemes.

    A "terrible" rush linebacker prospect? You sir are just trying to prove a point that we all already know - he isn't going to be a great pass rusher off the edge.

    Thanks for reiterating it like 5 times though!
     
  8. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Silly me... I tend to prioritize edge rushing in edge rushers.
     
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  9. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Then it's a shame that if we drafted him we'd be putting him on the edge.;)

    In a round about way you just agreed with him, you're of your game today MBF. My advice, you need to notch up the hostility a little more, and enhance the feel of superiority, maybe hype your blog page or the self made MtlBoltsFan T-shirts you wear around the house. Really make sure everyone knows they're your bitch when it comes to the internet.:tup:
     
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  10. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I was kind of confused. He started with "what are you talking about???" And then proceed to tell me I was right in a hostile way.
     
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  11. MtlBoltsFan

    MtlBoltsFan Jesse Ventura/Howard Stern 2016

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    Man you guys are drinking the kool-aid......... Jesse Kump said he is a terrible rush linebacker prospect which is total bullshit. Even if he is only a mediocre to above average pass rusher off the edge in the NFL, that doesn't make him a "terrible prospect" at the position. If you think his edge rushing ability is "terrible" you need to get your cataracts removed.

    Nobody gives a **** if you prioritize edge rushing in edge rushers, we all do. The point is that you called Kyle Van Noy a "terrible" rush linebacking prospect which is total bullshit. Kyle Van Noy isn't a "terrible" prospect no matter what linebacking position he is called upon to play and this is universally recognized.

    Go back to school son you need to watch your choice of words because your choice is "terrible".
     
  12. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Listen-- I'm genuinely sorry that you don't know how to identify good fits for our team. I realize that must be hard for you and I understand how that struggle might make you angry. So we'll just forget about that little outburst (and, I guess, all your other posts of ever?).

    KVN is a terrible rush linebacker prospect. If I told you that I LOVE "Cornerback X" because he is a great run defender, kick returner, looks great at safety, and oh wait-- he can't cover receivers... hmmm. That might be a problem. If a player is great in all the ancillary areas of the position, but bad in the primary one, he isn't a good prospect for that position. In fact, I would call such a player a "terrible" prospect for that position. Especially when Mr. Angry Pants is talking about him for the 2nd round.

    Should we be looking for players to play receiver who can't catch? Offensive linemen that can't block? Really arrogant forum members that can't find good players (oops... see what I did there)?
     
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  13. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    I am so fracking confused, so is KVN or isn't KVN a terrible Pass Rusher????

    Jesse says he is, MTL says he's not but then says he is.
    Kemp says he is again, then MTL responds saying he isn't a terrible edge rusher but then counters by saying he is a terrible edge rusher

    I have Madonna's big @#$% coming out of my left ear and Toby I don't know what coming out of my right.
     
  14. Moses

    Moses Yeah Buddy!

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    Weren't you just playing the victim a couple of days ago about how you never insult anyone and how people attack you when you don't agree with them.

    "I wasn't a douche to anyone...... all I did was state my opinion... Just because you guys disagree with my opinion doesn't mean you have to attack me!!" - your exact words from 2 days ago.

    Now we hear:
    Get your cateracts removed, go back to school son, nobody give a **** about what you think.

    The reality bro, is that plenty of people here do give a **** about what Jesse thinks, he is as entitled to his opinion as anyone else and it's getting pathetic that all you do is this keyboard warrior act every time someone shares an opinion that you don't like.
     
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  15. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    <3 you Moses. Parting the Douchie Sea that we all may pass!
     
  16. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    He's the powder blue Moses!
     
  17. Riff Raff

    Riff Raff BoltTalker

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    If any of you were comedians or scouts this MIGHT be funny. Instead it makes you all look like sad sacks of ****.

    Maybe that's really the intent of these forums.
     
  18. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Just like how you're a loser if you comment on football without being a coach.

    Oh wait...
     
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  19. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    New mock, I'm just trying it on to see how it fits......

    1. OLB Anthony Barr - It's time we had someone on defense again that needs to be game planned for. This is a move for 2015, not necessarily this year.

    2. (TRADED) - Should be enough to get us in top 10-15 range, and teams will be desperate to trade back so we may not even have to give up the 57 pick, it's very possible a 1st and 3rd could do it.

    3.
    Stanley Jean-Baptiste - Typically as a rule I don't like big CBs, but we need someone to go man up on Demariyus, and who could move in and cover a TE.

    4. WR Josh Huff - Reminds me a little of Hines Ward mixed with Andre Roberts, I think it's a safe pick.

    5. DE Aaron Lynch - Why, after Barr? Because I think he could get up to 275 and put his hand on the ground in a 5 technique in sure passing situations, to add a little more rush with Ingram and Barr on the outside. He could also play OLB if someone goes down.

    6. C/OG Russell Bodine - A fire plug, could play RG this year and then move to C next year.

    7. NT Beau Allen - I like him as a prospect, had a very strong pro day after snubbed at combine. Could be a UDFA, but I wouldn't want to miss him.
    7. CB Brandon Dixon - I expect we'll get 1 comp pick so here it is, the pride of NW Missouri State.

    Everyone has us trading back or taking 1 of 3 players, I just wanted to see how it'd feel if we are all shocked and Telesco makes a move to get a player he (might) love, like Barr or Dennard. After the trade it was clear I couldn't hit all our needs in 1 draft, so I picked almost ignoring some of our most glaring immediate needs in favor of 2015.
     
  20. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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  21. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Wouldn't mind it, as far as "surprise picks" Su'a Filo is right there as ones I'd be happy with, especially if he can play center.

    Right now I'd prefer Morgan Moses because he can play 4 of 5 O-line positions. We could start him at RT and move Fluker to RG (where I believe he could be a Pro Bowler), or put him at OG and move him to LT next year if Dunlap continues to have concussion issues, or just leave him at OG. Either way it ensures Clary is a goner, and gives us a realistic backup for King Dunlap so we don't get burned like we did last year.

    Bitonio is also a very intriguing option later on in the draft.
     
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  22. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Agreed, I also have noticed (although nothing in the draft is certain or predictable) The prospects the chargers have interviewed and worked out in the pass rush department (Van Noy, Attaochu, Boyd etc. etc.) It seems likely they'll be waiting on a pass rusher by the interest in later rounds prospects.

    Although I would love to add a CB like Fuller or Verrett on the roster, adding a player a versatile player like Su'a Filo may be a "smarter" approach at 25. It may come down to the idea of which is considered BPA at that point, the best OG/C in the draft vs. the 3rd 4th or 5th best CB in the draft. Although the talent as it stands right now may look to drop after Gilbert, Dennard, Roby, Fuller, and Verrett (it's near impossible to project how they truly transition into the NFL)
    I do really like both EJ Gaines, and Phillip Gaines as well as Ross Cockrell along with a couple other CBs that can be had in later rounds.

    At this point I'd the the idea of

    Fuller/Verrett, Su'a Filo, Lee and Ford
     
  23. Riff Raff

    Riff Raff BoltTalker

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    Not everyone. ;)
     
  24. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    Don't know if we'll have to trade up that far for Barr. There is a real good chance he falls because teams realize he will be a bit of a project.

    If we're going corner in the 3rd, few guys I like rather than Stanley Jean-Baptiste. SJB will be a project as well coming in. He is better suited for press coverage and we all know Pagano likes his cushions and does not play to his players strengths. SJB will be Derek Cox in this scheme. He has terribly stiff hips, much like Cox. Add the fact by the time he'll be a starter he'll be 25, since it will take him about 1 year to crack into the lineup.

    Rashaad Reynolds, EJ Gaines and Victor Hampton are some of my favorites in the 3rd round. All 3 have great route recognition skills and can undercut routes well but have more experience playing in off coverage.

    Aaron Lynch should be a 3-4 OLB. He was actually more effective at Notre Dame with his hand in the ground, but he also had Nix, Lewis-Moore and Tuitt helping him on the inside and they ran stunts a lot for Lynch. Watching tape at USF, he's a bit frustrating to watch. He shows violent hands where he makes the OL look silly and has the flexibility to bend on the edge. He has length as well as closing speed. I don't even know if he lasts tip the 5th, I think a team rolls the dice in the 3rd or 4th on him.
     
  25. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    On another forum, I put together a list of all the guys who I consider to be "good" boundary corners in this league and their combine 40 times (or pro day if the combine time was missing). Now I'm not a believer that 40 time is the end-all, be-all. BUT, it does seem that there is a threshold for success in the NFL. Right around 4.55, the percentage of success takes an extremely precipitous dive. The two current exceptions are Brandon Browner (4.63) and Brent Grimes (4.57). Which makes sense, as both are very good at disrupting receivers off the ball in press (which we rarely do). Basically, my conclusion is that you shouldn't draft a guy slower than 4.55 and expect him to be a decent starter at corner (slot corners are a little different). And if you do, it better be late because the chance of hitting on that pick is statistically low.

    If that is true, it really decimates what I perceived to be a lot of depth in this corner class. Roberson (4.61), Desir (4.59), Breeland (4.62), Mitchell (4.63), Hampton (4.69), Purifoy (4.61), and Jean-Baptiste (4.61) all well over the mark. If those times are legit (and I don't know how they wouldn't be with other guys still running in the 4.3's), I don't hold out much hope for those prospects to be successful on the outside. And the post-first round prospects you're left with are E.J. Gaines, Philip Gaines, Keith McGill, Jaylen Watkins, Rashaad Reynolds, Andre Hal, Dontae Johnson, Bennett Jackson, and Brandon Dixon. Some nifty sleepers, but hardly a list I'd count on for immediate help. Really underlines to me the importance of taking Verrett or Fuller if they are there at #25.
     
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  26. Riff Raff

    Riff Raff BoltTalker

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    You couldn't be much more wrong about SJB if you had intentionally set out to do it. He's VERY fluid, flips his hips well (particularly for his height), and takes very few false steps. He's shown plenty of ability to play off.

    Where he struggles is being over-aggressive jumping routes and is a poor form tackler. It's true he will be a project as he has only 3 yrs at corner but he's worth our 3rd if there.
     
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  27. charger1993

    charger1993 bad motherfucker

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    dont sleep on breeland. Didnt play in the sec, but he did well shadowing wrs at clemson
     
  28. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I'm not sleeping on him. I badly wanted him in the 2nd before he ran. But if he's going to be successful on the outside in the league, he's either a) a huge exception to the rule, or b) faster than 4.61 and somehow ran that slow on accident or something. It's just how things have been and currently are in the NFL.
     
  29. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I honestly don't know what I was smoking earlier. I have no clue why I said that about SBJ. My mind has been all over the place last few days with the end of spring break, mid terms and other personal problems.

    But, the biggest problem I have with SJB is not only is he a project but as you mentioned his technique. His tackling is poor and his inexperience at CB and also over-aggressiveness shows on double moves, which is a big issue because he does not have that recovery or deep speed to catch up. He can develop very nicely into a top CB but he has to clean up some things in his game.

    A project in the 3rd round just doesn't cut it for me. Especially when there's so many more options we can go with such a deep class.
     
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  30. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    I've stated in another thread, hips and backpedal are more important than pure straight-line forward speed. The 40 is nice for getting some assessment of a cornerback's closing- and recovery speeds, but otherwise it's a bit of an overrated drill for them. We've seen plenty of guys that had great track speed, but because they throttled-down in transition or just lacked fluidity in their hips, they were typically playing catch-up in the pro's to receivers which rarely put them in positions to contest/defend passes.

    In our current scheme especially, a smooth, efficient backpedal is tantamount - because of the cushions Pagano and Milus insist on giving opposing receivers the majority of the time we have to have guys who don't get that cushion eaten up any quicker because of an inefficient backpedal, otherwise to the effect listed above except typically with guys with lesser recovery speed (hence why they're playing with cushions to begin with).

    Some guys in the class simply don't fit our system terribly well - Breeland is one of them, McGill is another. He can function in it, but our system doesn't play to his strengths - and as such because of our system I value him a full round lower than I would for teams that run certain other schemes. Conversely, a guy like Desir fits our system extremely well, same with both of the Gaines'. A guy like Dontae Johnson gets lauded for his athleticism and posted a respectable 40-time, but put on the tape and the guy struggles mightily playing off-man because he's stiff in his transitions.

    Again, we're not getting two starting corners from this draft - people are fooling themselves if they think that. But this class is deep enough that we could still snag a player capable of starting with a 2nd or 3rd round pick. That's deeper than most classes (where the cut-off point is almost always the 2nd barring some players that slip through the cracks). In general, I agree, yes, that the 4.55-4.56 range is a solid cut-off (rule of thumb) for boundary guys. Scheme - and good fit to the scheme supported by tape - can likely buy a guy a 3 or 4/100th's buffer - which is why I feel like Desir shouldn't be thrown out. The guy is a long-strider, he's faster and smoother on the field than he's going to be on a track. And the tape supports that at least 4 of the guys that you listed that did make the cut can make immediate impacts. They're not going to be standout, lockdown corners - rookie corners rarely are. But they can certainly be comparable-to, if not an improvement over what we got out of Richard Marshall last season. Throw in Steve Williams to the mix - who does have sub-4.4 speed - along with (hopefully) improved pass-rush and there's justifiable reason to believe that the performance of the secondary would improve.
     
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