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mock draft

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by charger1993, Feb 17, 2014.

  1. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I definitely agree about prioritizing other skills over 40 speed. So long as said player is within the threshold or near enough. For example, I'd definitely take Fuller over Roby even though he's about a full 10th slower in a straight line. But at 4.49 his speed is still more than adequate, and he does basically everything else better than the aforementioned.
     
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  2. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Agree on Fuller over Roby.

    But when I see CBs in the 4.6s and 4.7s that worries me a lot.
     
  3. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Yep. The track record for success just isn't there. I don't think this bar is set all that high:

    1. Quentin Jammer: 4.42
    2. Champ Bailey: 4.29
    3. Chris Harris Jr.: 4.48
    4. Aqib Talib: 4.44
    5. Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie: 4.29
    6. Nnamdi Asomugha: 4.45
    7. Antonio Cromartie: 4.47
    8. Brandon Flowers: 4.55
    9. Sean Smith: 4.50
    10. Dunta Robinson: 4.34
    11. Carlos Rogers: 4.44
    12. Chris Culliver: 4.40
    13. Tarell Brown: 4.45
    14. Richard Sherman: 4.54
    15. Brandon Browner: 4.63
    16. Walter Thurmond: 4.53
    17. Marcus Trufant: 4.38
    18. Janoris Jenkins: 4.46
    19. Cortland Finnegan: 4.34
    20. Patrick Peterson: 4.34
    21. Jerraud Powers: 4.43
    22. Jason McCourty: 4.30
    23. Alterraun Verner: 4.52
    24. Johnathan Joseph: 4.31
    25. Kareem Jackson: 4.40
    26. Vontae Davis: 4.49
    27. Greg Toler: 4.45
    28. Will Blackmon: 4.46
    29. Dwayne Gratz: 4.44
    30. Jabari Greer: 4.50
    31. Keenan Lewis: 4.47
    32. Captain Munnerlyn: 4.51
    33. Desmond Trufant: 4.38
    34. Asante Samuel: 4.49
    35. Darrelle Revis: 4.38
    36. Brent Grimes: 4.57
    37. Stephon Gilmore: 4.40
    38. Leodis McKelvin: 4.39
    39. Terence Newman: 4.37
    40. Brandon Carr: 4.44
    41. Morris Claiborne: 4.50
    42. Brandon Boykin: 4.40
    43. DeAngelo Hall: 4.37
    44. Corey Webster: 4.50
    45. Prince Amukamara: 4.43
    46. Joe Haden: 4.57
    47. Leon Hall: 4.38
    48. Adam Jones: 4.42
    49. Ike Taylor: 4.18
    50. Lardarius Webb: 4.46
    51. Corey Graham: 4.42
    52. Tramon Williams: 4.57
    53. Sam Shields: 4.26
    54. Chris Houston: 4.32
    55. Charles Tillman: 4.49
    56. Tim Jennings: 4.32
    57. Antoine Winfield: 4.41
    58. Xavier Rhodes: 4.43
    So there's 58 guys. 4 of them over 4.55. Only 1 in the 4.6's. Just not good odds.
     
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  4. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    True, though just out of curiosity, are you taking those numbers all off combine times or best time posted in the pre-draft process (i.e. pro days too, since IIRC that's where Joe Haden improved his time). If so, we probably ought to hold off final judgment till seeing those numbers ("friendly tracks" as some of them may be).

    Also, Ike Taylor is fast, I know that - he was timed in the past 5 years at 4.26 seconds, and it makes sense as he was also a sprinter at ULL. I do know that that 4.18s 40 is hotly contested though, given that it was an unofficial hand-time at ULL's pro day when he was a prospect.
     
  5. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Combine where available to make the comparisons as fair as possible. Otherwise, pro day times. Most of them are from the combine. And I'm sure Taylor isn't that fast, but you can add three 10th's to that time and he still fits well under the threshold so I just put what was listed.
     
  6. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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  7. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    I don't. I don't think we need a LT. I think we need OL help for sure, but not strictly a LT.

    We currently have King Dunlap, who will see out his contract and possibly get another extension if he is concussion free this up coming season. Mike Harris, who is capable to start at LT as well as swing to RT and move inside to OG. Nick Becton, who is waiting in the wings as a developmental prospect that Joe D is putting together.

    I think we should take an OL in the first 3 rounds, but versatile enough to switch positions. Like Xavier Su'a-Filo who would be a starter at OG, eventually moving to C when Hardwick calls it quits. Like Joel Bitonio, who will be a starter at OT/OG, but also having the capabilities of possibly playing all 5 OL positions.

    I trust what Joe D does and wants. We will be plucking away at guys in the UDFA pool and also later rounds in the draft for sure despite what we do in the top half of the draft.
     
  8. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    So I did a mock off of fanspeak simulator, (which I like because instead of me making my hopeful biased picks I had to pick what was given to me which adds somewhat more of a realistic approach)


    25
    CB JASON VERRETT
    TCU
    [​IMG]
    I still believe if Verrett were 2" taller, he could easily be considered the best CB in this class. Although size and physicality are considered Verrett's weakness, he has elite instincts and play making ability which is needed to play in our scheme. He seems like a very hard worker and plays with a huge chip on his shoulder. Based on what I have read, he is a very quick learner and corrects his mistakes on the go.


    57
    OT JACK MEWHORT
    OHIO STATE
    [​IMG]
    I'll admit I was aiming towards Joel Bitonio then when he was gone I set my sights on WR Davante Adams who was quickly scooped up right after. Mewhort was my selection based off of his versatility to play 4 or 5 positions on the offensive line. What I like about Mewhort is the mean streak he possesses with his run blocking, and his pass protection (which does needs some cleaning up, and seems like he has the want to type attitude to do so) I project him as our starting RG, but with his versatility, he could eventually develop into our starting center. He may not be the most appealing pick at #57 but I would welcome his versatility and lunch pale attitude.
    (Think of him as a talented Jeromy Clary:))

    89
    DE MARCUS SMITH
    LOUISVILLE
    [​IMG]
    Marcus Smith could easily be considered a steal at this point, Smith has only been playing on the defensive side of the ball for 2 1/2 years and easily had his best season last year while still learning the position. Luckily and hopefully for us we can use him sparingly to rotate with JJ in passing situations where he can learn and get better so he can eventually step in to fill that role permanently. He has shown his ability to drop into cover as well as get to the QB. (sad but true could easily be our top pass rusher)

    125
    WR PAUL RICHARDSON
    COLORADO
    [​IMG]
    I see Richardson being the (Robin) to Allen's (Batman). His Speed, shiftiness make him a very solid play maker in a Golden Tate, T.Y. Hilton sort of way. If he were bigger and stronger (which will most likely happen in the NFL overtime) some could argue he has the ability to be a clear number one WR on a team. Adding Richardson on our team would help keep defenses honest with his ability to stretch the field as well as make plays after the catch.

    165
    CB ANDRE HAL
    VANDERBILT
    [​IMG]
    I like to idea of adding 2 corners in this draft, if for nothing more than for pure depth. I'm still not sure how I truly feel about Shareece Wright being our number 1 CB right now and even if he is, he has proven not to be the most durable. I think we should bring in another CB for competition and truly put the best 53 on the field. Like Verrett, Hal is a much better player in off man/zone schemes, has great instincts and has improved his vision and awareness greatly this year. I see Hal starting out on ST's and possibly pushing for a starting job later on down the line.

    201
    DT ZACK KERR
    DELAWARE
    t[​IMG]
    I'll admit, I didn't know about Kerr until LBC told me about him, but the more I learned the more I wanted him to be our NT. Along with his Explosion off the ball, ability to draw and split double teams, ability to rush the passer with elite quickness for a big man, his run stopping ability. He also appears to have a great work ethic, he has great characteristic traits and is a natural leader who can get teammates and coaches fired up. I believe his biggest knock is the fact he played against lesser competition, but his play did get him an invite to the east west shrine game and Combine. He's Dontarie Poe without the stupid haircut.

    240
    DE AARON LYNCH
    USF
    [​IMG]
    This is just a random throw in, Lynch appears to have all the talent in the world but doesn't show the "want to" I think with proper coaching and team leaders we may be able to get us another good player all the way in the 7th. Realistically, just with the character concerns I doubt this is even a remotely possible pick for us. Although it would be nice if he could get his butt in gear.


    Overall I'd be very happy with this draft, thoughts or input is welcome. Like I've said in a previous board I only know what I see or read, so if a player I listed above doesn't have an elite 10 yard split, of doesn't have a 40 degree bend around the edges, I apologize.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2014
  9. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I can't take those simulators seriously. They spit out such unrealistic results.
     
  10. charger1993

    charger1993 bad motherfucker

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    i think he ran slower than he expected, kid is faster than a 4.61, just like sammy watkins is faster tahn 4.43
     
  11. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I think that's wishful thinking. I've heard a lot of fans say the the same things about several of the guys who ran slow at the combine (Purifoy, Mitchell, Roberson, Hampton, etc.). But they ran what they ran.

    Plus Breeland went to his pro day and ran a 4.62, 4.58, and 4.57. Basically confirmed that he has high 4.5/low 4.6 speed. Which just doesn't play in the NFL.
     
  12. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    This is true, I was getting ready for my 2012 fantasy football draft, I figured I'd test a a couple different scenarios to see what could potentially be available to me, Every time I gave myself a 5-10 number to pick through the later half
    Foster, Ray Rice, McCoy, Rodgers, Megatron, MJD were the consensus picks throughout the process (somewhat in this order) I always take an RB in the 1st so I kept setting myself with MJD and Forte

    Then draft day happens, I end up with 5th pick (thinking do I take Forte or MJD?)
    Arian Foster
    Ray Rice
    Aaron Rodgers
    Andrew Luck?!?!?!?! Some dude actually took Andrew Luck in the first that year (funny thing was his 2nd round pick was Trent Richardson, we then had to inform him that this is a fantasy draft and not the real NFL draft)
    I ended up with McCoy

    So although the simulator is a bit off with some of the orders (one time it had Clowney go to the Rams with their 13th pick) I like it due to the fact that it allows you to pick through the players that are available, When humans pick humans its a completely different animal, no way in a million years did I think in that fantasy football draft I was getting McCoy if I didn't have pick 2-4. Just like last year when some mocks had Te'o and Allen going in the mid 20's @ where the Vikings were picking, If I were to tell anyone that the Chargers would end up with both of those players in the 2nd and 3rd round everyone would have called me an idiot or crazy.

    I respect your analytic opinion, (in fact you're the only reason I venture over the the CMB and torture myself through the minds of people with no idea what a salary cap is and suggest Telesco is terrible because he didn't chase after the top dollar free agents, or not trading a draft pick for a high priced locker room cancer)

    But please tell me, who's to say what is or isn't realistic in a mock draft?
     
  13. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I can only speak for myself… so… me.

    We'll see whether I'm right or wrong in due time. But the FF draft argument isn't doing anything for me.
     
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  14. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    For anyone that's interested, we're going to be running a site wide 7-round mock on my site starting some time next month (we just wrapped the mock offseason where we acted out all offseason practices of cuts, resignings, new signings, extensions, trades, 7 rounds of draft, and UDFA signings - but that's not as wholly realistic either).

    The version we'll be doing in April is just draft (and UDFA). It obviously is more "fan-voted" than in line with what GM's would/probably do, but you do get the real life reflection of in-the-heat trade-up's, typically more realistic trading (i.e. the position or quality of player moved up for), and greater appreciation for what prospects actually fit team schemes. Feel free to join us - we've got a small, but tight-knit and fun Chargers sub-forum community - a lot of them folks who got tired of the CMB many years ago and needed a refuge.
     
  15. Duffman57

    Duffman57 BoltTalker

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    I've kind of thought up what i would consider my ideal mock...

    1st: Louis Nix III NT, ND (No guarantee he'll be there, but IMO a pro ready NT who is going to be a good 2 down starter right away isn't something you pass on when you have a huge need there IMO)

    2nd: Jeremiah Attaochu/Marcus Smith/Trent Murphy, OLB's, GT/Lousville/Stanford (I like all of these pass rushers, and these guys can all get it done. These guys all have solid potential rushing the passer and all are really smart players, good fit for what we like)

    3rd: Joel Bitonio OG, Nevada

    4th: Phillip Gaines CB, Rice (I'm not sure if he'll be here, but he's damn good, and really long/athletic. He could be a guy who's not a great fit for scheme but can REALLY cover.)

    5th: Mike Davis WR, Texas (I'd take Josh Huff here if i thought he'd be available, but solid fit for this offense.)

    6th: Aaron Colvin/Marcus Williams CB, Oklahoma/North Dakota

    7th: Howard Jones/Larry Webster OLB, Shepherd/Bloomsburgh (With no other glaring needs on this team, even for depth, i'd double up on both CB's and Pass rushers to see if we can develop some athletes)
     
  16. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    This is probably the best/realistic mock draft I've seen.

    1. 25. OG. UCLA. Xavier Su'a-Filo
    [​IMG]
    2. 57. WR. Fresno State. Davante Adams
    [​IMG]
    3. 89. CB. Oregon State. Rashaad Reynolds
    [​IMG]
    4. 125. OLB. USF. Aaron Lynch
    [​IMG]
    5. 165. DE. Virginia. Brent Urban
    [​IMG]
    6. 201. NT. Delaware. Zach Kerr
    [​IMG]
    7. 240. OG. Wisconsin. Ryan Groy
    [​IMG]
     
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  17. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Not "realistic" enough for me, try again!:)
    I don't think I would spend a 4th on Aaron Lynch, The stuff he pulled at ND taking plays off then transferring schools suggesting the school wasn't a "right fit for him" then I looked like he would still continue to take off plays at USF. The Chargers target players who love the game and want to get better, from what I've read, Aaron Lynch doesn't fit that bill. I'd much rather double dip at a 2nd position in the 4th than to take AL. I like the other picks a lot
     
  18. SuperCharger92

    SuperCharger92 BoltTalker

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    Well, Aaron Lynch won't make it to the 5th round. He has all the measurables scouts want. If you watch tape of him at USF, Lynch shows violence in his punch and other traits. He can bend the edge with his incredible length, at 6'5, 250 with 34 inch arms. He ran a mid-4.6, which isn't bad coming off a hamstring injury. But, the key is he has untapped potential. Getting a year to learn from vets like Jarrett Johnson and Dwight Freeney will better prepare him for a starting role in the future.

    If he develops, he has 1st round talent. And at the OLB position, we can afford to take a development prospect because we have depth there and vets to help him bloom. He'll be a situational pass rusher as well. But, he isn't terrible against the run, he's actually pretty good.

    It's not like we just target these players who "have a love for the game". I mean, even though they were an UDFAs, Kwame Geathers took plays off at Georgia. You could even say Byron Jerideau did as well. Both were inconsistent at times. We don't know what Telesco will do, but to say he only aims for those types of players and ignores all others is rather premature given he has only been involved as a GM in 1 draft.

    And Lynch moved back to USF because he felt "homesick". He is from Florida about 2 hours out from USF. His mom moved with him his freshmen year to help him adjust. He didn't pull anything at ND, he just did feel comfortable there and he mentioned it in his limited interviews. He did get unnecessary penalties if thats what you mean, but he was a freshmen at the time and he's a high intensity player. We need those types of guys on defense.

    This was not my mock draft. But, probably the best one I've seen for the Chargers and one I like very much. I don't know what's not realistic about that, many of those players are in the round level on my board.
     
  19. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Did that really upset you? I was critiquing the simulator, not you.
     
  20. Bolts4lyfe

    Bolts4lyfe BoltTalker

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    Not upset, It was an unintentional jab that I was making a joke of how his was labeled best/realistic, even though aside from positions it was almost similar to mine. , agreeing that the simulator is horse @#$%. I still like it for the fact that instead of looking at a list picking (favorites) I have to pick what is available.
     
  21. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    Oh, I see what you were doing. My bad.
     
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  22. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Here's one of my latest ones

    #Chargers Mock Draft
    1st Round: Brandin Cooks WR Oregon State
    I'm starting to wonder what the Chargers will do if all the first round pass rushers (in this case Attaouche even went in the first) and cornerbacks (Kyle Fuller had been taken already) are off the board. No Nix either. So, screw it, I went with a hell of a WR to team with Allen as a deep threat.

    2nd Round: Stanley Jean Baptiste CB Nebraska
    I think a lot of his flaws are correctable and he already shows some good instincts especially in the zone we run. What also intrigues me is he is incredibly fluid for someone that size. Those are things you really can't teach as much, and the tackling I think can be fixed.

    3rd Round: Demarcus Lawrence OLB Boise State
    This is a prospect I've fallen in love with. Think he's an outstanding combination of power and speed that's just scratching the surface of potential. He already can hold the edge against the run and unlike other rushers, he doesn't run by blockers but takes them on and beats them. He needs to be worked with but I think he could learn a ton in a year from JJ and Freeney.

    4th Round: Marcus Martin C USC
    Why he is this far down I don't know but I jumped on that like a starving dog on a T-Bone. Hardwick is one year, two at most, from retirement. We better get this solved ASAP. Martin already has a good head on his shoulders, has good instincts and is used to making calls at the line. He needs to improve on his pass blocking but you won't find many powerful experienced centers this late to spend a year learning at a great Charger's footsteps.

    5th Round: Ed Stinson DE Alabama
    Another player I'm very fond of because all he does is play hard and control the line of scrimmage. He's already well experienced in a 3-4 and could be a very Olshansky like player who plays the run well as part of the rotation. He's not that fast and hasn't played huge numbers of snaps but he's a great depth pick up.

    6th Round: Nevin Lawson CB Utah State
    He's under 6 feet tall but like SJB he has instincts, speed, fluidity of movement and great awareness in zone. UNLIKE SJB he's already a good tackler and a very very good run defender. I think the Chargers would be foolish to come out of this draft with less than two CBs and for a sixth rounder Lawson can provide some great depth and development to potentially become more.

    7th Round: Zach Kerr NT Delaware
    Leave it to the Delawarean to pick a Blue Hen. Of all the later round nose tackles, he's the one I like the most, and it's not even close. This is a guy I've watched dominate his division as a powerful run stopper that can take on and beat double teams. He needs work on his conditioning and he has a bit of a concussion history but he's my third best nose tackle on the board and to grab him in the 7th is a steal. The Chargers might not have great experience but between him and Geathers-Jerideau, the team has some bright potential at NT.
     
  23. Jesse Kemp

    Jesse Kemp BoltTalker

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    I don't understand the hype around SJB. I know he's big and I'm not saying he's stiff, but he's far from a special athlete. And watching him play corner is rough.
     
  24. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    I don't even care about te ND stuff, what concerns me is how invisible he was at USF.

    But the thing is you don't get freakish athletes like that on day 3 unless they have a huge flaw. I'm not sure what Lynches deal is, but at some point the potential reward is going to outweigh the risk. He could legitimately be the next Shawne Merriman (hopefully minus the steroids), if he wanted to be, he certainly looks like him at times.

    Plus I think we have a relatively strong locker room with guys like Freeney, Johnson, Weddle etc...guys who would take a guy like that under their wing and steer him.
     
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  25. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    People are willing to forgive because "he hasn't been playing the position long," which I get... but if he was sub-6'0" and 10 pounds lighter I doubt he's even being talked about beyond a mid/late Day 3 prospect because his tape isn't really that great.

    People (draftniks, fans, you name it) are in a tizzy to find "the next Richard Sherman," and they seem to be forgetting that what makes Richard Sherman, Richard Sherman isn't that he's got such outstanding length, size, athleticism, but rather that he's an extremely heady football player, with an outstanding IQ for the game and game psychology, and (despite the act he puts on in front of a microphone) he's actually an extremely unselfish player - which is rare among skill position players in general (i.e. he'd just as soon, if not sooner, go for the tip to a teammate for a turnover as he would make the more difficult/risky grab himself).
     
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  26. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    Ego mostly - or just one of those guys whose been coddled his whole playing career because of his superior athletic, but has yet to demonstrate a willingness to take part in the grind.

    Simply put, I'd say that a large factor in whether we have Lynch anywhere (and subsequently where, if he is) on our board is going to be Te'o. They're going to consult him for an insider (and then-team-captain's) opinion of what the kid is like on the practice field, in terms of game study, work ethic, and as a teammate. It'd be foolish not to utilize that resource.
     
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  27. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    At some point I'd like to see us a take a chance on a player like this. Right now I feel like we have a roster full of choir boys, particularly on defense, it's been a long time since we've taken on a chance on a player with some rough edges and huge potential. It doesn't have to be Lynch, but like I said he could not ask for a better situation than the one he'd be coming into here.
     
  28. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    I'd say let the culture become a bit more entrenched before going that route though. Would it be nice to be able to do? Yes. Is it worth what could, realistically, be risking what is an extremely favorable culture still in its infancy? Not right now.
     
  29. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    I guess I'm skeptical that 1 rookie, in a locker room full of established veterans (....Gates, Rivers, Hardwick so on...), can bring down a whole culture.

    Do we have any other guys with work ethic or entitlement concerns?
     
  30. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    It's more a case for me that I don't undervalue 6th and 7th round picks. If you scout right, you can find quality starters (not just depth or developmental guys). So I'd rather not commit the resource to someone who doesn't appear to want it. If we're talking Aaron Lynch as a UDFA, by all means. I don't like the idea of wasitng resources on him.
     

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