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New 2012 NFL Mock Draft

Discussion in 'NFL Draft' started by DFlo, Feb 5, 2012.

  1. DFlo

    DFlo BoltTalker

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    Hey guys, I've updated my mock draft for the end of the season/pre-combine.

    You can check it out here: 2012 NFL Mock Draft

    Let me know what you think. Would love to hear your feedback!
     
  2. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    I'm not opposed to selecting Barron but if he's chosen, I'd hope we would have added a good pass rusher in FA. Still it fills a need.
     
  3. Ikeman83

    Ikeman83 Werter Pöbel

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    If the Chargers sign a pass rush and don't pick up a SS, I could see this happening. There's a lot of beef left on the table, and 2 OLB prospects still on the board in your mock. Are you looking for an opinion of how likely this scenario is to happen or how well we like the pick at 18 given the situation?
     
  4. DFlo

    DFlo BoltTalker

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    Both. Yeah it was either OLB or SS here, and I think Barron had much more value at that point.
     
  5. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    I can accept it as a "pre-combine" projection if only because I feel like the combine is going to wreck Barron's stock and boost Perry's enormously. Barron's Roman Harper, very little more, and I'm not just saying that because both played at Bama, I'm saying that because both are near identical in their strengths and deficiencies.

    Barron's got decent hands, fair vision to read QBs' eyes, but that in itself does not a good coverage safety make, especially in the NFL where safeties are asked more and more to cover slot receivers and this new(er; let's face it Gates started this movement) of ulta-athletic TE's. Barron's hips lack the fluidity and flexibility to run with these kind of receiving options; it says quite a bit when on obvious passing downs Saban was putting in a 3rd safety for coverage and moving Barron into the box as effectively a glorified LB who was rarely if ever asked to cover anything more than an RB playing outlet receiver.

    The guy's not even the best safety on his own college team. Barron's stock will stay somewhat high because of the relative dearth of this safety class, but had even two or three of the top underclassmen safeties declared he'd have likely slipped to right where his value actually kicks in... mid-to-late 2nd round.
     
  6. Ikeman83

    Ikeman83 Werter Pöbel

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    If Barron can't cover TEs, then for this team he isn't a 1st round pick.
     
  7. DFlo

    DFlo BoltTalker

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    Barron is an in-the-box safety like you guys have mentioned and I think he's a perfect complement to Weddle. He's top 20 and I think next mock I might have him going to the Jets, hence freeing up the Chargers draft slot for possibly an OLB.
     
  8. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    Then considering the Chargers needs for a compliment to Weddle who is the centerfielder and is best playing deep, then who from this safety class would you take? We do need someone who is more physical and a bigger hitter to compliment Weddle but can also cover well.
     
  9. Buck Melanoma

    Buck Melanoma Guest

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    Rodney Harrison. ;)
     
  10. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    He actually fits Ryan's defense extremely well - better than he fits ours to be honest (I say this assuming that Pagano's scheme will be some amalgam of his brother's and Wade's, which seems like a fair assumption). He's just - from the tape I've watched - straight trouble if you ask him to cover anyone but RB's and the kind of TE's who don't have the speed to play in the NFL as starters. If a team could afford through scheme to play him as a Darren Sharper type - where he's effectively allowed to freelance 90% of the time - he can be productive. But those are rare situations, and even when Gregg Williams and New Orleans let Sharper play that role Roman Harper was getting habitually wrecked by opposing TE's, it was just less noticeably because they had Scott Fujita who is actually pretty effective covering the short and medium routes against TE's - despite being a sup-par blitzer.
     
  11. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    I think "big hitters" are somewhat becoming a thing of the past in this league. I'd settle for a guy with better body-control, a better-than-average vertical, and a doberman mentality in tackling (latches on and doesn't get shaken loose). Harrison Smith and George Iloka (I personally like Smith better than Iloka because his hips look more fluid and he takes more decisive, less-wasteful steps in his movement and change-of-direction) fit that mold... along with being "bigger" guys. Markelle Martin pairs really well with Weddle IMO because he's a lot like Weddle - with better hands IMO. He may have to leg-tackle some bigger TE's and RB's, but if he gets hold of a leg the other guy's going to have to drag him down the field with him if he's getting any further. Like it or not, I think our current coaching staff has this bur up their butt to play a 2-zone safety scheme - it's not ideal, but at the same time there is argument where it can be effective in modern NFL with the right mix of pass-rush (see our game against Baltimore this past year, as well as the final game of the season against Oakland).

    I like a lot of what I've seen from Arkansas' Tramain Thomas. Great blend of athleticism and aggression. He has some rough edges (tackling technique, namely) that need smoothing out, but he's shown to be a quick study, so he's one of those guys who I could certainly see making noise in the preseason and at minimum pushing for meaningful reps in a rotation at S early in the season as a rookie (he reminds me a lot of Dashon Goldson as a prospect).

    And I'm actually interest to hear Buck's take on Eddie Whitley - the guy needs to add about 10 pounds or so in bulk, but if he hasn't already started doing that by now in preparation for the draft, a full training camp will definitely help him in that regard.

    Truthfully though, the only pure safety prospect I love in this draft is Martin - it's a pretty meh class otherwise. There are a couple CB's I think that could convert to safety rather well (Donnie Fletcher from BC for one, Mike Harris from Florida State - though I like him as a development CB prospect better, Trumaine Johnson from Montana... if he can manage to stop getting arrested so often, and Bama's DeQuan Menzie - the guy on the other side of Kirkpatrick).
     
  12. Ikeman83

    Ikeman83 Werter Pöbel

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    I think that one thing we need to consider with whoever it is we're "hoping" the Chargers draft is that they may have to play in a totally different scheme next year. I think it's something of a crapshoot as to who will be there at 18, but I would prefer not to draft a player who will be a cripple in anything except for 1 specific role, especially as a 1st rounder. SS is something of a tweener position, and if we're spending a 1st the guy had better be able to provide decent run support, blitz, play a deep/intermediate zone and man up on a TE. If he can't do all of those things (or will never be able to do all of those things) then he isn't worth the 1st, though a player who can't do those things now but could develop them over a few years into his game might be worth a later round investment.
     
  13. Ikeman83

    Ikeman83 Werter Pöbel

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    Absolutely agree. I think the SS position has become, as a result of the defenseless receiver rule changes, less about destroying the WR mid-catch and more about providing CB quality coverage on bigger targets over the middle. One thing that was showcased heavily in the playoffs this season was how dominant and prominant large, pass-catching TEs have become. I think it's still important that a SS be able to take on a large RB in the box, or beat a RB on a blitz, but being a tackle monkey seems to me to be significantly less important than providing quality coverage against the larger targets.
     
  14. The LBC

    The LBC I'm a Real Prick

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    I agree, just fixed one little part that I bolded. I've got no problem with a tackle monkey, provided he does those other facets at an average-to-above-average level as well. Like I said, I'll value the sure-tackler over the big-hitter until the league changes the rules on contact past 5-yards allowed against receiver by defenders. It's why I've become a bigger proponent of collegiate CB-to-Safety converts. You've got guys out of Oregon in Jairus Byrd and T.J. Ward, both of whom were collegiate corners, but have flourished as safeties in the current professional ranks. And that's excluding the guys who were drafted in the 1st round that you'd expect to have the athleticism and skill-sets to be position/scheme versatile regardless like Malcolm Jenkins.

    A lot of the taller corners in the collegiate ranks tend to be more wiry anyway and have the kind of frame that can take on a little extra muscle/bulk without sacrificing in the athleticism/quickness/etc. dept. The main issue is getting these players on-board with playing safety because it is historically a lesser-paid DB position in the league than corner is.
     
  15. Buck Melanoma

    Buck Melanoma Guest

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    Whitley huh .... I'll try to takeoff my VT homer cap for this. ;)

    Hard worker, good instincts. Not particularly fast - roughly a low 4.5 guy but he has a nose for the ball so game speed is more than adequate. Good tackler - breaks down well & wraps up. Physical for his size. Durable, played a LOT of snaps for VT as he was on ST , played some corner (particularly in the nickel), & rover as well. In a pinch he can return kicks. When he gets his hands on the ball he usually comes up with it - tracks the ball well in flight, has a good vertical, & will fight for possession. Bud Foster is a very good DC so he's been coached up. If you play for Bud you have to be tough & have a strong work ethic. He likes that "lunch pail" kind of guy & Whitley fits that mold. Don't know of any character issues. Like you said - he could add 10 lbs. or so but IMO has the frame to do that w/o sacrificing speed. I'd give him a low 3rd to high 4th round grade. If we could grab him in the 4th or even 5th he'd be really good value. Combine performance will be a big sell for him. I think he'd team up well with Weddle as he understands responsibilities & doesn't tend to freelance or get burned.
     

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