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Rookie DT expectations to high?

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by ThunderHorse17, May 10, 2010.

  1. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8180ced6&template=with-video-with-comments&confirm=true

    A great read. Found it intersting that they mentioned last years NT class as I have been trying to follow them for the fact that we passed on Jwals replacement then and I even liked Sammie Lee Hill. Glad we didnt go NT last year from that article info.

    Also this immediatly screamed to me AJ talkin wout being directly quoted:

    The real money in any draft is spent in the first two rounds. One general manger, who could have taken a defensive tackle in the first two rounds but passed, thought the 2010 class was a little inflated and could be in for a rude awakening.

    Sounds like AJ to me, tho im not sure how many teams that REALLY needed NT in the first 2 rounds there were besides us...
     
  2. Brundlefly

    Brundlefly Well-Known Member

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    Stupid article. It's measuring DT/NT on the basis of tackles and sacks. By the way they do it, Haloti Ngata is pretty below average.
     
  3. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    Exactly. Even when Jamal was in his prime, his best year he only had 69 tackles, 49 of which were solo.

    3-4 NT's aren't supposed to rack up stats. Their job is to occupy multiple blockers and let the LB's run up the stats.
     
  4. LightEmUp

    LightEmUp Banned Banned

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    Expectations are high because we are in need at that position. The anty is also up'd by having to replace a Pro Bowl HOF NT in Jamal Williams.

    But this allows a rookie to make a name for himself and a big contract down the road. When a team is in need they will throw money at someone who produces. - See Jyles Tucker.


    I wish our Rooks luck - we need their contributions.
     
  5. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    We definitely do. It is a shame that AJ refuses to pick up starter quality FA's, even if they aren't the big named/big money guys. This would allow us to have a stop gap, while giving our young guys time to develop. Expecting a 5th round NT to be a stud on day one is ridiculous, and expecting the same out of a undersized ex-rental car worker or a scrub like Garay, is just as ridiculous.

    We don't need a stud, but just need quality. Right now, all we have is quantity and very little quality
     
  6. LightEmUp

    LightEmUp Banned Banned

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    I dont see anyone emerging either. I was really stoked on Travis Johnson but he just didnt bring it like I thought he would last year. Probably due to his daughter being sick. I have a hard time at work if the hot water was used that morning. I can only imagine what he went through last year.
     
  7. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    I agree, except that he isn't a NT.

    If you read Kevin Acee's mailbag, or put any stock behind his opinion, he says he thinks the Chargers will only carry 6 defensive linemen, and Johnson would be #7 if they decided to carry 7. But the 6 he thinks will be on this team, which really scares me, is Castillo, Cesaire, Martin, OG, Garay, and Thomas. That is 3 kids who are still probably a year, if not 2, away from making an impact. Then there is Castillo who can't stay healthy. Then Garay and Cesaire who are both career backups. I definitly don't have a warm and fuzzy feeling that our line will be any better this year than the crap we saw last year
     
  8. JUGGERNAUT

    JUGGERNAUT BoltTalker

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    aubrayo franklin, jason ferguson, and jay ratliff are not nose tackles cuz they don't fit this guy's ideal size b.s.
     
  9. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    There are exceptions to all rules, but it doesn't mean everyone is an exception. There is a reason 3-4 NT's are usually 330lbs+, it is because it has been proven over and over and over again throughout the years that they have more success than 99% of people smaller.

    It is no different than trying to say just because Steve Smith is able to be a top WR at 5'9", that teams should be looking for short guys like him rather than the prototypical 6'+ guys. He is the exception, not the rule
     
  10. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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  11. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    Definitely possible, not sure if it is probable. I just wish AJ would have address NT and RB the last 2 years when he knew the guys he had were on their last leg. Now we are throwing rookies into the fire and expecting immediate impact, which isn't something we have seem from too many rookies over the last few years. A few have started, but they also had a lot of struggles their rookie year.
     
  12. BoltzRule

    BoltzRule Well-Known Member

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    Who knows how it'll work out, you have to give the young guys a shot if you expect them to develop (Siler, Floyd, hopefully Cason etc.). There is young talent there and who knows one or 2 may surprise us, Rivera showed he can make the rotation work the 2nd half of last season, we'll see what he can do this season.
     
  13. DenverBolt67

    DenverBolt67 BoltTalker

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    And it took all those guys 3+ years to do anything. Yet we are expecting the linemen to do something on day one or even in their 2nd year? If they do, great. But to expect it, I think is totally unreasonable. And to go into the year with nearly half the players at a position, being projects without legit starters in front of them, is even more unreasonable.

    I still don't see how that "rotation" worked as people keep saying. The line got destroyed nearly every play, especially at the NT spot
     
  14. ThunderHorse17

    ThunderHorse17 Lone Wolf

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    On Siler he did have to work his way onto the team as a starter. Not saying he had very stiff competion, but our coaching staff then beleived we were fine at ILB with Wilhelm and Coop.

    It did take a while but finaly MY BOY Siler worked his way onto the starting roster.

    Far as Cason he had a great rookie year in the nickel, then dissapeared and now we are playing the Cromartie game of wait and see who he is.

    On the rook linemen, im expecting more out of our current players to get better at playing when called upon whatever the positon DE DT.

    What I wanna kno is is it impossible for a DE to take up a double team on say the LG and LT... If so that to me screams the same scenario of a double team on one Dlineman and freeing up the edges for the OLBs...

    I am not a football expert only a football addict/fannatic...:icon_shrug:

    Also the SD Run D did improve from near worst in the leauge to modest before the season ended.
     
  15. BoltzRule

    BoltzRule Well-Known Member

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    We'll see if these guys pan out this year, but we won't know until they are given a shot, same with the other players I mentioned.

    As far as the rotation goes, it's not dominant, but it's solid, the rotation did a lot better in the 2nd half of the season, than our DL did in the 1st half. You add some experience to those young guys and hopefully they improve. Only way to find out is by having them play. If it doesn't AJ has shown he'll fix our biggest hole.
     
  16. Enormo

    Enormo BoltTalker

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    Agree. Expectations are high but they should be moderate. Getting another body that can perform a notch better than the filler we had in there last year would be a win. Anything beyond that will be a welcome surprise.
     
  17. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    The expectations should be a little higher then a normal 5th rounder. I think the expectations are higher because of his talent, the value and his attitude towards being drafted so late (all of which have been stellar). just gotta let him do his thing
     
  18. Buck Melanoma

    Buck Melanoma Guest

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    No .... we have to tell him what the Charger thing is & motivate him to do it whenever he's on the field. Letting him do his thing will lead to more inconsistent effort.

    Thomas was & is a 5th round talent. That's why he dropped to the 5th - because teams saw that the hype was more about size than substance. Can he play NT? Sure - if he wants to put in the time & effort. We'll just have to see how much motivation our staff can instill.
     

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