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Should Priests marry?

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by Carrie1219, Jun 22, 2009.

  1. Carrie1219

    Carrie1219 Banned Banned

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  2. HollywoodLeo

    HollywoodLeo Well-Known Member

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    I don't see why they shouldn't be able to, but it's the path they choose.

    Catholic law has a lot of crazy stuff that makes no sense.
     
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  3. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    Yes they should. Many Saints were married and there was nothing in Christ's crusade involving sulevecy (SP).

    I can understand promoting monogamy but sulevecy (SP) is just not human.
    For example... the outbreak of pedophile priests should not have come as a surprise to anybody. Cause any man who says he's going to rid himself of any and all sexual activity has sexual problems to begin with.
     
  4. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    No, they should just continue sleeping with boys then have the church cover it up.
     
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  5. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    They and I think buddhist monks are the only religious leaders that don't marry. Rabbis, Imans and most priests marry; and in the case of rabbis/imans its required
     
  6. Carrie1219

    Carrie1219 Banned Banned

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    So rude and crude... :tdown:
     
  7. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    Brutal truth.
     
  8. Carrie1219

    Carrie1219 Banned Banned

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    Maybe you can recall the percentage of priests who were found to be involved in the molestation of boys... What was it 1/2 of 1 percent of total priests? It's a shame that you make such a generalization and basically lump all priests into the category.
     
  9. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    It was a joke Carrie.
     
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  10. Carrie1219

    Carrie1219 Banned Banned

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    Sorry... I'm tense lately and trying to get ready for a vacation, with everything on the work and home front going the hell.... :icon_shrug:
     
  11. HollywoodLeo

    HollywoodLeo Well-Known Member

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    Even with it being such a small percentage, I wonder if the cases that do occur wouldn't if the offendors had a more natural way of relieving themselves.
     
  12. Johnny Lightning

    Johnny Lightning Go Bolts

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    I think so :tup:
     
  13. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Should they marry? I dont see why not. But each religion has their own dogma, and that has to be what is dealt with. It is not an easy answer.
     
  14. Johnny Lightning

    Johnny Lightning Go Bolts

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    Some of the disciples of Jesus were marred... I think they took that verse out of the bible where Paul said it would be better if you were not marred...

    I guess you will have to ask God...He will tell you...
     
  15. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    So pedophiles would have easier time controlling themselves if they were...married to women?

    That doesn't work logically or psychologically.

    Pedophiles have been married in some cases and it still causes them to commit crimes
     
  16. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    Good point. It may or may not have an affect on the number of pedophile priests but I still think it's a good idea to let priests marry and promote monogamy.
     
  17. HollywoodLeo

    HollywoodLeo Well-Known Member

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    While I don't get the idea that being maried causes them to do it, I don't think that's what you meant and I get your actual point.
     
  18. Game123

    Game123 Well-Known Member

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    Should priests be allowed to marry? Since I'm not Catholic, I just don't care. But if you want to know why the Catholic Church does not allow priests to marry, all one has to do is take a look at the Church's history.

    Catholic priests, at one time, were allowed to marry. Even the Pope could have a wife. The problem with priests and Popes marrying was simple... They had the capability to bestow titles and lands to their heirs, including their priesthoods. Over generations, they became more concerned with gathering wealth and power than they were about promoting the Church's christian agenda. This is one of the main reasons why priests and Popes cannot marry today.

    Link to similar opinion: http://www.futurechurch.org/fpm/history.htm

    A Brief History of Celibacy in the
    Catholic Church

    First Century
    Peter, the first pope, and the apostles that Jesus chose were, for the most part, married men. The New Testament implies that women presided at eucharistic meals in the early church.

    Second and Third Century
    Age of Gnosticism: light and spirit are good, darkness and material things are evil. A person cannot be married and be perfect. However, most priests were married.

    Fourth Century
    306-Council of Elvira, Spain, decree #43: a priest who sleeps with his wife the night before Mass will lose his job.
    325-Council of Nicea: decreed that after ordination a priest could not marry. Proclaimed the Nicene Creed.
    352-Council of Laodicea: women are not to be ordained. This suggests that before this time there was ordination of women.
    385-Pope Siricius left his wife in order to become pope. Decreed that priests may no longer sleep with their wives.

    Fifth Century
    401-St. Augustine wrote, “Nothing is so powerful in drawing the spirit of a man downwards as the caresses of a woman.”

    Sixth Century
    567-2nd Council of Tours: any cleric found in bed with his wife would be excommunicated for a year and reduced to the lay state.
    580-Pope Pelagius II: his policy was not to bother married priests as long as they did not hand over church property to wives or children.
    590-604-Pope Gregory “the Great” said that all sexual desire is sinful in itself (meaning that sexual desire is intrinsically evil?).

    Seventh Century
    France: documents show that the majority of priest were married.

    Eighth Century
    St. Boniface reported to the pope that in Germany almost no bishop or priest was celibate.

    Ninth Century
    836-Council of Aix-la-Chapelle openly admitted that abortions and infanticide took place in convents and monasteries to cover up activities of uncelibate clerics.
    St. Ulrich, a holy bishop, argued from scripture and common sense that the only way to purify the church from the worst excesses of celibacy was to permit priests to marry.

    Eleventh Century
    1045-Pope Boniface IX dispensed himself from celibacy and resigned in order to marry.
    1074-Pope Gregory VII said anyone to be ordained must first pledge celibacy: ‘priests [must] first escape from the clutches of their wives.’
    1095-Pope Urban II had priests’ wives sold into slavery, children were abandoned.

    Twelfth Century
    1123-Pope Calistus II: First Lateran Council decreed that clerical marriages were invalid.
    1139-Pope Innocent II: Second Lateran Council confirmed the previous council’s decree.

    Fourteenth Century
    Bishop Pelagio complains that women are still ordained and hearing confessions.

    Fifteenth Century
    Transition; 50% of priests are married and accepted by the people.

    Sixteenth Century
    1545-63-Council of Trent states that celibacy and virginity are superior to marriage.
    1517-Martin Luther.
    1530-Henry VIII.

    Seventeenth Century
    Inquisition. Galileo. Newton.

    Eighteenth Century
    1776-American Declaration of Independence.
    1789-French Revolution.

    Nineteenth Century
    1804-Napoleon.
    1882-Darwin.
    1847-Marx, Communist Manifesto.
    1858-Freud.
    1869-First Vatican Council; infallibility of pope.

    Twentieth Century
    1930-Pope Pius XI: sex can be good and holy.
    1951-Pope Pius XII: married Lutheran pastor ordained catholic priest in Germany.
    1962-Pope John XXIII: Vatican Council II; vernacular; marriage is equal to virginity.
    1966-Pope Paul VI: celibacy dispensations.
    1970s-Ludmilla Javorova and several other Czech women ordained to serve needs of women imprisoned by Communists.
    1978-Pope John Paul II: puts a freeze on dispensations.
    1983-New Canon Law.
    1980-Married Anglican/Episcopal pastors are ordained as catholic priests in the U.S.; also in Canada and England in 1994.

    Popes who were married

    St. Peter, Apostle
    St. Felix III 483-492 (2 children)
    St. Hormidas 514-523 (1 son)
    St. Silverus (Antonia) 536-537
    Hadrian II 867-872 (1 daughter)
    Clement IV 1265-1268 (2 daughters)
    Felix V 1439-1449 (1 son)

    Popes who were the sons of other popes, other clergy
    Name of Pope Papacy Son of
    St. Damascus I 366-348 St. Lorenzo, priest
    St. Innocent I 401-417 Anastasius I
    Boniface 418-422 son of a priest
    St. Felix 483-492 son of a priest
    Anastasius II 496-498 son of a priest
    St. Agapitus I 535-536
    Gordiaous, priest
    St. Silverus 536-537 St. Homidas, pope
    Deusdedit 882-884 son of a priest
    Boniface VI 896-896 Hadrian, bishop
    John XI 931-935 Pope Sergius III
    John XV 989-996 Leo, priest

    Popes who had illegitimate children after 1139
    Innocent VIII 1484-1492 several children
    Alexander VI 1492-1503 several children
    Julius 1503-1513 3 daughters
    Paul III 1534-1549 3 sons, 1 daughter
    Pius IV 1559-1565 3 sons
    Gregory XIII 1572-1585 1 son

    History sources:
    Oxford Dictionary of Popes; H.C. Lea History of Sacerdotal Celibacy in the Christian Church 1957; E. Schillebeeckx The Church with a Human Face 1985; J. McSorley Outline History of the Church by Centuries 1957; F.A.Foy (Ed.) 1990 Catholic Almanac 1989; D.L. Carmody The Double Cross - Ordination, Abortion and Catholic Feminism 1986; P.K. Jewtt The Ordination of Women 1980; A.F. Ide God's Girls - Ordination of Women in the Early Christian & Gnostic Churches 1986; E. Schüssler Fiorenza In Memory of Her 1984; P. DeRosa Vicars of Christ 1988.
     
  19. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    No no no
    What I was wondering was WHY would it supposedly fix pedophiles or make them less likely to commit their crimes if they were married to women? They have a thing for kids, so being married to a woman will probably not fix that, I've never heard that marriage allows pedophiles to control themselves
     
  20. HollywoodLeo

    HollywoodLeo Well-Known Member

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    I understood what you meant.

    I was just a bit confused by this.

    "Pedophiles have been married in some cases and it still causes them to commit crimes"

    I don't think it's what you meant, but the wording there makes it sound like you're saying that being married causes them to commit the crimes. (as opposed to just not preventing them from doing it.)
     

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