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The honeymoon is over!

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Concudan, Nov 3, 2013.

  1. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Absolutely. In real time, I kinda doubted that Woodhead actually got in, at first, but it was ruled a touchdown,
    and none of the repeated replay angles showed--definitively--otherwise. I think they implied that he went
    out about 4 inches before the pylon, but no angle proved it, so I felt there was no justification for an overturn.

    So I was surprised they took back the TD. Then they said "6 inches" and I thought: "Close enough" to the 4" I'd guessed.

    But then, yes, the ball was inexplicably spotted well behind the 1/2 yard mark?!?
    Again, this is the third time the officials appear to be jobbing the Chargers on a single play…
    but after all that, it's still 1st and goal inside a yard, with timeout. Send Mathews over the top
    on first play, Washington can't stop him. Chargers win. 5-3 and a happy plane flight home.

    Never in a million years could I have conceived of McCoy's plan…that bucked conventional
    wisdom to try something cute…leading to the 2nd horrible loss in 6 weeks, that followed directly
    from abysmal late 4th quarter McCoy decisions. Grrrr.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2013
  2. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    It was more than where it should have been placed....the ref actually called the spot. No one thought to yell at the other ref placing it?
     
  3. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    any qb can sneak from 6 inches too
     
  4. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Well, yeah, and--as I said before--this ain't exactly the defense of the '85 Bears here.

    Why wasn't McCoy screaming bloody murder when the ball was not placed at the "6 inch" spot?!?

    Well, once it wasn't, that changes the equation: I agree, almost any QB (and certainly one as big as PR)
    can shove forward for 6 inches…but since it became closer to 22 inches, I felt Mathews over the top
    was now the best call. Remember how hopeless the Seahawks were of stopping him,
    when RM went up and over on them? (or the Cardinals…or the Ravens…or...)
    images.jpeg
    Screen Shot 2013-11-05 at 7.54.10 AM.png
    Screen Shot 2013-11-05 at 7.57.41 AM.png
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    But I learned from SD fans that Ryan always fumbles when he tries to score.

    On that note, fans are more powerful than they think. In a Toronto bar, I was told by a guy who didn't watch football that Norv was the worst coach in the NFL. I asked him how he could think that if he didn't follow the game and his response was, "My friend in San Diego told me".
     
  6. Joy Division

    Joy Division Slightly-known Member

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    His statement in a bar held less power than what your statement holds here (and your statement is weaksauce).
    My statement rules (it's a known fact that if you make this statement, it will in fact, rule).
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  7. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    Great, now you got Conc over and over again repeating that in a mirror

    Here's another one! Most non Chargers football fans believe Marty was fired by AJ- even though his firing was correctly reported on at the time...in fact, most journos now remembering the story have adopted the echo chamber's version of history.
     
  8. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Naw, the "Norv Is Horrible" narrative was written before Norv even coached his first Charger game.
    (I believed it too, until an objective examination of the data revealed Norv to actually be about a C+ coach, overall...
    nothing to write home about, but nowhere near the train wreck that most casual fans believed...
    based largely on regurgitated fan "wisdom" on PFT and clueless guys in Toronto bars.)


    I think you've mis-judged Charger fans: sure there are a few ("Lose to win!" [to get draft picks]) clowns,
    but they truly are a relatively small (though loud and Dunning-Kruger-ish) sample. Most Charger fans are
    more knowledgable and sensible. A big part of the problem is the fans who started following the team
    in the last decade: The Chargers had an unprecedented good run...no losing seasons from 2003 until
    a 7-9 last year. :eek: Of course, old-timers remembered more Charger losses than wins up to that amazing run,
    but newbies were astounded that the Chargers could ever be a .500 team or less. When the Chargers
    went 9-7 in 2010 I actually heard numerous newbs saying "It can't get any worse than this!" :roflmao:
    Hilarious to those of us that endured 2-12 & 1-15. Yes, Charger fans are a bit more fickle than fans of
    some (not close to all!) teams, and yes, San Diego does have wonderful attractions like sunny beaches for those who
    can't afford a $300 day at Qualcomm...but overall the fans are pretty good. And who knows,
    maybe a couple of 6-10 or 3-13 seasons will slow people from calling Mr. 58.3% "the worst HC ever!!!"
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  9. tittylated

    tittylated bolttalk cheerleader sweet

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    ya but you have to account for the talent norv had at his disposal. he should of gotten more wins out of that team then he did we were superbowl caliber.
     
  10. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    Seriously? You think I typed all of that...without considering the talent on every single Charger
    roster since 1969?!? (the first game I can remember, and when my Charger obsession began).

    Norv began with much better than (Charger) average rosters, and, predictably, his records (32-16 over first 3 years)
    and playoff appearances reflected that.
    Later, the roster declined (retirements, injury, etc.) to about average, predictably, his records
    (24-24 over final 3 years) and (lack of) playoff appearances reflected that.

    About 98% of NFL coaches post records that correlate strongly and predictably with their rosters.
    (see: Bill Walsh before & after Joe Montana, plus the next 300 coaches you prefer to test this theory with...)
    Norv is one of the 98%.
    Overall, he did slightly better than average (hence the "C+") with the talent he had,
    when you factor in the lousy rosters (and records) he had in Washington & Oakland.


    p.s. I think the 2009 team was the one that could have one the Super Bowl...unfortunately Norv, uncharacteristically, missed 3 field goals against the Jets, one awful day, after 11 straight wins...
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2013
  11. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    In all honesty Norv was not that bad of a Coach for us. I hated the hiring and screamed like a mad man. But he came in and left as one of the winning-est coaches in Chargers history (Sid Gilman still has the most wins with 86 followed by Coryell then Norv). As the OL talent was reduced (Thank you AJ you egotistical so-and-so) Norv failed to change his game plan to let PR17 get rid of the ball quicker. That was all on Norv. But he did have the fourth highest winning percentage, and at the end of (if I recall correctly) the 2011 season he had the highest.

    That said, I am glad he and AJ are gone. We needed a fresh take, and for the most part I love McCoy-Whissy-wigs offense. What I dont like is that Norv seemed to be able to put the ball in the end-zone with more regularity than McCoy-Whissy-wig. I get nervous when ever we enter the red zone because we do not seem to score a lot of TDs from inside the 10... or 15 perhaps. At least that is my perception, which I haven't researched to see if it is true.
     
  12. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    Golden Mean!;)

    Not just to Lance, Norv was a great coach or at least far better than average. Talent-wise, the team was best in '06 with 07 being a close second. take that 07 team and remove LT and Rivers for most of a game and injure Gates and it was a much worse team than a healthy 06 team----THAT team beat the Colts in the playoffs after beating the Titans earlier in the playoffs. The coach won that game as much as a coach can win a game.

    That 08 team was worse compared to the teams before it (Weddle had no business starting in the playoffs) but they beat the best team in the NFL in the playoffs. No one in their right mind thought the'd beat them again. Great coach.

    09 team was even worse (sorry Lance) and the irony for me was that even though through great coaching that team went 13-3, Turner should have been fired by himself for insubordination, but he instead stayed quiet and allowed politics to start LT against the Jets and the year long white hope project to bury the best running back they had that year. But hell, 13-3 with all that and 3 missed field goals? GREAT coach.

    To those pointing at the chargers' quick pass success under Wisenhunt and McCoy...take away a healthy Slot, healthy Tight End, elite Scat, 1st round right tackle, and actual starting linemen, and correlation would be put in perspective (yeah I know Norv had Sproles but his offense was doing pretty damn fine for however he used his pieces before it became the average record achieving disaster of the last 2 seasons when he didn't have Sproles) .

    Screw the mob and the reasonable middle, Turner was outstanding:abq1:
     
  13. ETicket

    ETicket Well-Known Member

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    What could go wrong?

     
  14. Lance19

    Lance19 BoltTalker

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    TOUCHDOWN CHARGERS!!!!!

    In all seriousness, every play has risk…that's the beauty of the game…
    but no one who knows this game is going to argue that passing isn't
    riskier than a 1/2 yard run.
     
  15. Kayworks

    Kayworks BoltTalker

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    [​IMG]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Ides

    What happen to Ground and pound game from last 4+ weeks? I have to call the BullS#$%T card. I'm still having a hard time understanding why we don't try to run the ball.
     
  16. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Don't like it, lump it!!!

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    I like the direction, just wish they had the players.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  17. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    This Norv hate excusing ABN's bad decisions also throws Telesco unfairly under the bus....this team's talent is better than last year's and they had the pieces to get that touchdown last Sunday
     
    • Old Old x 1
  18. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    so matilack, has Telesco improved the roster at all? I really like the new GM and it's funny watching people concentrate on the coach to avoid confronting their contradictions.

    So...how would you rate Telesco's performance?:)
     
  19. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    Outside of the terrible mistake of letting Phillips and Barnes walk, I feel TT did the best he could with 7 draft picks and a cap number dragged down by a lot of dead weight. I think the Dunlap signing has been quietly brilliant (concussions aside), as has Woodhead and Rinehart. Fluker has worked out surprisingly well (I was not a supporter of this pick) and Allen looks like a legit #1 target and he wasn't even supposed to play much this year.

    Defensively as I said before the season started, when you can't rush the passer everyone starts looking bad, particularly the DBs. Losing Ingram in camp was bad, and losing Freeney was devastating thanks to the aforementioned free agents walking away.

    It wasn't flawless but it wasn't a bad 1st offseason for Telesco.
     
  20. Burlington Bolt Brother

    Burlington Bolt Brother BoltTalker

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    so offense is good enough to get to the one yard line but doesn't have the players to overcome that?
     
  21. matilack

    matilack #therealagent47

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    I think we do have the players, I think that's why most people here are frustrated with McCoy and Wiz. I just don't get why you wouldn't use Mathews in the 2nd half, or why Ladaruis Green only gets 4 snaps the entire game and isn't in the game when we reach the redzone.

    There's talent not being tapped in game deciding situations.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  22. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Don't like it, lump it!!!

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    What does Norv have to do with any of this? Sure they have more talent this year not by much and they still need a few more of the impact type guys to get to the top.
     
  23. HEXEDBOLT

    HEXEDBOLT Don't like it, lump it!!!

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    What a trip, I don't know how or why that happened.
     

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