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Was Hester A wasted bunch of picks?

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by BOLTS4LIFE, Apr 26, 2009.

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  1. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    They may have been talking about him, but the carries did not greatly change.

    Actually in 2006, his stats were not a lot greater than in 2007...
    10 attempts vs OAK
    13 attempts vs Ten
    7 attempts vs Bal
    11 attempts vs Pit
    1 attempts vs SF
    4 attempts vs KC
    5 attempts vs STL
    2 attempts vs CLE
    1 attempts vs Cin
    4 attempts vs Den
    7 attempts vs SD
    4 attempts vs Sea
    11 attempts vs ARI

    Not a big change between the final Marty year and the first Norv year. Again he was used as a change of pace.

    This season we will probably see more mixing in of the second RB, and possibly more FB carries. That should be to keep LT healthy and teams off balance.

    I think you will see Hester more, things take time to develop. Remember the Chargers have been in a unique position to allow young players to develop slowly, no need to rush them in.

    Hester is one of those cases I believe.

    MT Chronology:
    2004 20 carries
    2005 57 carries
    2006 80 carries
    2007 71 carries
    2008 354 <---- Starting for the Falcons.
     
  2. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    Exactly. That's what I said in the very beginning... like all rookies, he needs time to develop. All that pointless arguing... geeze!!!

    BTW... keep these things in mind...
    In 2004, we had Jesse Chapman.
    In 2005, MT was still developing.
    in 2006, MT was injured for a few games.
     
  3. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Alan, you might want to reflect a bit on the fact that it takes two to argue. What I have been doing is posting my position in a very non argumentative way.

    So where is the argument coming from? I have taken what you have posted and simply put down my opinion.

    Where we have disagreed is over the fact that you seem to have felt that the Coach and GM (Based upon your initial post) were keeping Hester on the pine.

    I feel that if Hester wants to play he will show it in practices.

    I have pointed out several things to back this up.
    1) Chargers can take their time in letting young players develop. Therefore it is not a conspiracy to keep Hester on the pine.

    2) Hester is not even the back up RB, that is Sproles, therefore he is going to have fewer touched than even Michael Turner did, which was NOT a lot. No conspiracy.

    3) Hester got his start at Full Back once Tolbert was injured, again not a lot of touches there.

    So if we are in agreement that the Chargers can let players develop slowly given the talent levels on the team, and that Hester will get more touches this year, then it sounds to me like we are in agreement that there is no collusion Between Coach Turner and GM Smith to keep Hester on the pine.

    Again remember my initial responce was just saying that you should change this:

    To something like this:

     
  4. in_a_days

    in_a_days dgaf

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    Off-topic posts relocated courtesy of yours truly.

    And now to make this post topical...

    Yes... Hester = a bunch of wasted picks. :yes: :icon_tease:
     
  5. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    No he isnt. It is refreshing to see a whiteboy running the ball. :icon_evil: :icon_rofl:
     
  6. in_a_days

    in_a_days dgaf

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    Yeah.... until every other guy on the field catches up with him. :lol:
     
  7. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    So long as it is 4-10 yards beyond the LOS, I am good.. :yes:
     
  8. reddenedbeard

    reddenedbeard Well-Known Member

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    I think B4L made the point that he is a rookie, blah blah blah .. so I would say only time will tell if the picks were a waste.
     
  9. in_a_days

    in_a_days dgaf

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    :lol:

    You're right of course gramps. Gotta give it another year or two before we can look through the lense of hindsight. But the guy needs to be a player to justify his cost. I have a hard time justifying investing even 1 second round pick on a FB, let alone multiple picks. So he really has to step into the H-back role successfully. In Norv's scheme even a fully capable FB isn't worth a 2nd round pick.

    Norv has to find a way to get the ball (and on the positive side of the LOS) into his hands or it's a waste IMO.
     
  10. reddenedbeard

    reddenedbeard Well-Known Member

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    I would say that Norv normally likes to use the FB receiving out of the backfield. This was one reason why Lorenzo wasn't suited in his offensive system. I wouldn't expect to see Hester to run the ball much in the future but he needs to step up his blocking otherwise he'll be looking for another job.
     
  11. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    If Hester is not starting on day 1 this year... yes... it would be a waste of picks.
     
  12. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    It's not a waste of picks nor can you truly discuss that until at least the end of the year
     
  13. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    Now that all this crap is out of the way and with a VERY misleading thread title created by Conc.... I don't think that Hester is a waste of picks at all. I like what I've seen and I'd like to see more of him.

    If any of you remember, he was suppose to be the answer to MT and/or Neil. Many fans were attending the preseason games cause they wanted to see Hester.
     
  14. Zeus

    Zeus BoltTalker

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    Its way to early to tell if Hester is a waste. So far he has shown that he is good at catching and running the ball. He is hard to bring down and gets hard yards. He has blocked very well and for a half a year starting I think he has show a lot of potential.

    The people who complain about the "picks wasted" on Hester on the same posters who complain about a teams 7th round pick. They are the ones that give people no chance to prove themselves, unless its a guy they like from their school. They get mad when AJ makes picks and "suggest" other players. The vast majority of the time these players they suggest fall far, don't get drafted, or if they do end up not really doing anything.

    That is why I don't listen to them, since it is obvious they know nothing about football.

    Its funny how many times these people are wrong.
     
  15. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Yup way too early to tell. I will say that Hester needs to step up and take the starting FB role. That is done in camp.
     
  16. Retired Catholic

    Retired Catholic BoltTalker

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    The crux of the biscuit. Correctomundo
     
  17. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    And you know he hasn't, how?

    You don't!!!
     
  18. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    I wanna go all the way back to this first post...

    Where did you want to pick a safety... and did you have a particular safety in mind? Also, why did you think AJ & Co. would want to pick a safety with an "earlier draft pick"?

    Lastly... so you didn't create this thread title? What was yours?
     
  19. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    No safety in mind. Maybe there were none worth a first round at that point but I'm thinking (and hoping) that we picked up the best defensive player available at that point.

    I didn't create any title for this thread. It was part of the "Draft Grade" thread. Conc got all bent out of shape on my comment about playing Hester which lead to piles of crap.
    So he created the thread title and moved some posts.
     
  20. reef shark

    reef shark BoltTalker

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    Not a 7th, a 2nd. Basically a 2nd and a 3rd for a guy who wasnt drafted to be a half back and cant lead block like a normal fullback. If people want him to be a productive h-back (like a chris cooley) then these people may be waiting for a long time.

    personally i didnt see it last year, he had some nice plays against denver in the last game but he dropped some key passes and fumbled during the season like any rookie could. but the consequence of this is the patriots getting either butler or brace which is what really bothers me
     
  21. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Actually I do know this. I am not afraid to investigate things. The fact that Hester only started a game after an injury to our last FB should tell you something...
     
  22. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    The Evil Dr. Conc strikes again!
    [​IMG]
     
  23. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    When was the last time you spoke to Norv about this?
    Did you ask him why we saw so little of MT in 2007 (since he wasn't nursing an injury)?

    You can speculate till your blue in the face but that doesn't mean anything.
     
  24. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    As pointed out in previous posts, we saw about the same of MT in 2007 as we did in 2006. There was no drop off in anything other than your mind...

    Your entire hypothesis is flawed.
     
  25. BOLTS4LIFE

    BOLTS4LIFE Banned Banned

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    And as I pointed out... MT was injured in 2006 and missed some games.
    What was the explanation for 2007?

    If it's my own mind, then why did MT's lack of field time get media attention in 2007?
    Why was Norv's response to the question "we haven't had a chance to use him?'
    How come so many other fans asked the same question?
     
  26. reddenedbeard

    reddenedbeard Well-Known Member

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    He had 9 less carries between 06 and 07. He played in 16 games at some point in 07 as opposed to 13 in 06. The biggest dip was the lack in productivity where he averaged 4.5YPC in 07 compared to 6.3 in 06. Coincidentally he averaged only 4.5 with the Falcons as well in 08.

    So, who cares what the media thinks. He was given the rock and he didn't have a good of year as previously.
     
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  27. Concudan

    Concudan Caffeinated Commando

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    Very well said. Thank you.
     
  28. in_a_days

    in_a_days dgaf

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    Just for the record 4.5+ YPC is elite. For a guy that touched the ball 376 times last year 4.5 YPC is huge.

    6.3 YPC is just completely absurd and no starter is EVER going to have those kind of numbers at the end of the year. That figure is skewed by several long carries in the fourth quarter that were set up by LT & the O-line beating the **** out of an opposing defense for 45 minutes.

    EDIT: Also it stands to be pointed out that the drop off in productivity correlates to Norv's no-blocking-FB scheme.
     
  29. Savage Lizard

    Savage Lizard Charger fan at 7000'

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    For whatever it's worth, I think that our pick was used by the Raiders (acquired in a trade) to take the guy nobody else was going to take until way late or not at all. I am happy that it was our pick that the Raiders wasted. :lol:
     
  30. reddenedbeard

    reddenedbeard Well-Known Member

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    Agreed .. but stats are stats. Whose to say that MT wouldn't have averaged 4.5 yds per carry under Norvs offense. As I recall, there used to be a pretty good one in Dallas at one time.
     
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