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We need to get back to running the ball first and foremost...

Discussion in 'Chargers Fan Forum' started by Boltergeist, Nov 17, 2008.

  1. Boltergeist

    Boltergeist BoltTalker

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    It may not happen until after Norv is canned after the season....but we need to get back to playing some physical football and forcing the run onto opponents. We are getting KILLED in TOP and we are living and dying on a lot of low percentage passing on offense. From what I've seen the past couple of weeks, LT is not over the hill and not close to it. Our runblocking is atrocious and we have completely moved away from most of our bread and butter running plays that made this team into a juggernaught in 2006. Consider this little comparison between LT (in his worst year by far) and Turner...who many seem to wish was still our starting RB.

    Putting Turner in the Chargers current offense with the regression in run blocking vs. Atlanta's very good unit and his success would be pretty limited also....especially when you consider that Turner is no where near the receiving threat Tomlinson is....If we are going to get technical, Turner ran for the same YPC against an abyssmal run D as LT did against the league's best unit. Against the really good defenses Turner has played against, he has had YPC of: 3.0 against TB, 3.1 against Carolina, 2.2 against Chi, 3.4 against Philly. He has fattened up against the bad defenses. Turner also has 4 receptions on the year to Tomlinson's 36 and YFS is almost identical.


    This team should not be put on Philip Rivers' shoulders week in and week out. PR is light years ahead of where he was in 2006...but would much rather see a QB passing for a little over 3000 yards and minimizing INTs working behind a solid run game than an open offense throwing for 4000+ yards with a ton of TDs and INTs which is where we are headed....and has also helped us to a 4-6 record. LT is getting healthier and should have a minimum of 20 rushes per game....the norm for a starting running back to really get into a flow. He has only done this in 5 of 10 games so far and really only 2 in which he's been healthy if you count most of the Carolina game.

    LT was not healthy for the better part of the first half of the season...but he is now....you could see it in spurts against the NFL's top ranked D yesterday...but as per usual we didn't commit to continuing to pound the rock and Rivers ended up choking.

    My offseason wish is that we get replacements for Goff, Hardwick and maybe Clary (some of which we already have on the team)....and a true non-hybrid blocking FB...and get back to basics....Run the ball...and systematically disect with creative passing.

    This means we need a new coach. Turkey neck needs to go.
     
  2. Ride The Lightning

    Ride The Lightning Join the Dark Side, we have cookies.

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    Yep.

    Completely agree.
     
  3. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    We need to nut up and learn to freakin run block and that's everyone from mcNeil to Tolbert (who I love but he's a running back not a full back). This team has all the toughness of a basket full of kittens. Run blocking is about attitude and drive, pass blocking is technique and skill. We've got skills and technique but no heart
     
  4. boltmanbz

    boltmanbz Well-Known Member

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    at 4.7 yards a carry seems like Sproles isnt having a problem finding where he is supposed to run
     
  5. Showmeyourbolt

    Showmeyourbolt Well-Known Member

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    And Felix Jones is averaging 8.9 yards per rush, so he's obviously better than Barber right:icon_shrug: Get real, backups and situational players who get fewer carries always have a higher YPA. Chatman did behind LT as well.

    In regards to the OP, I agree completely. We relied on the big play all year, and it hurts us in the redzone, and in having consistent drives. We scored a lot of points, but we haven't had a ton of long, seven minute drives that can break a team's back. We've lost our hit you in the mouth identity on offense, and it hurts us the most in the red zone. Goff is on his *** more than any other offensive lineman out there, and the line as a whole is unidentifiable when compared to how that unit played in 06.
     
  6. Aggieman

    Aggieman I bleed blue and gold

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    give the ball to LT has turned into give the ball to Sproles. That is kind of wierd. But I think we'd be better off trying to do what Atlanta is doing successfully - mixing it up, almost never running on consecutive first downs, catching defenses off guard. This offense is far to predictable to be as productive as it should be, which all falls on Norv Turner's shoulders.
     
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  7. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    Let the hogs eat. They are not being fed nearly enough.

    RUN THE BALL NORV!!!

    :bolt:
     
  8. mrjgoo

    mrjgoo BoltTalker

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    Hey there! Can anybody tell me why The bolts would not just let Pitt score, and have 2 full minutes to drive back to score and win? Obviously Pitt was well within range of a field goal, and to stubbornly hope to stop that is to me crazy and obviously time consuming. Am I totally wrong?
     
  9. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    I'm pretty sure we were all screaming in unison at the TV during that time.

    That blew my fu/cking mind.

    We wouldn't have had the full 2 mins, but pretty close. Plus I believe we would have had 1 time out too.

    This is what I'm talking about... this team can't even LOSE CORRECTLY. How can we expect them to win? :icon_shrug::lol:
     
  10. PowderLove

    PowderLove Former Mod, Current Slacker

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    And I'm already gone
    And I'm feelin' strong
    I will sing this vict'ry song, woo, hoo, hoo, woo, hoo, hoo
     
  11. Boltergeist

    Boltergeist BoltTalker

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    Not only that...but let's get some packages and plays in there that get us running the ball effectively....Then it's on the linemen to just nut up and start moving us forward instead of letting two defensive players into the backfield by the time LT even touches the ball.

    I remember Patriots players in 2006 after the playoff game commenting that our OLine was NASTY and just wouldn't quit for LT....what happened to that intensity and commitment?
     
  12. Showmeyourbolt

    Showmeyourbolt Well-Known Member

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    Norv
     
  13. AnteaterCharger

    AnteaterCharger Calibrating Bolttalk, Podcast by Podcast Staff Member Super Moderator Podcaster

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    i don't know but i've never heard of a team that had such a pissed off and fiery OL turning into a passive prissy one so suddenly with no new personnel (minus clary)
     
  14. LV Bolt Fan

    LV Bolt Fan Well-Known Member

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    $$$$$$
     
  15. nickelbolt

    nickelbolt Fuggedaboutit

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    to me it's not so much about YPCarry as it is about Att/game. You need to be up near 30att/game in order to let your linemen get into a rhythm of sorts. You need to pound away until you break the defense's will. You know the snap count... they don't. You know the play... they don't. That alone should be enough to win the matchup battle more times than you lose it.

    I'm not going to do all the legwork because I've already wasted too much time thinking about this. But I do know we're no where near 30att/game. Last I checked we were somewhere near 24/25. That's good for one back, but not when you have the supposed talent we do.

    Pittsburgh could have been put away if we just committed to grinding it. KC would have been destroyed.

    LT is right to be calling this shiit out. The lineman, though, are the ones who should be speaking up. It's my opinion that the best teams have the linemen controlling the locker room. Something tells me that ain't the case in San Diego...

    I'm spent.
     
  16. sdbound

    sdbound Well-Known Member

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    This is the kind of strategy failure that gets coaches fired.
     
  17. Showmeyourbolt

    Showmeyourbolt Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. You break a team's will with the running game. In regards to the attempts per game, it's just about right where you put it:

    We average 24.4 rushing attempts each game, and those numbers have gotten lower as the season has gone on. As sad as it sounds, the team actually ran the ball more when LT was injured! Early in the year, we ran the ball 35 times against the Jets (The only game this season where LT has gotten 25 carries), and 30 times against Oakland. We haven't reached the thirty carry mark against any other team this year. If you take out that 35 carry game, we average 23 carries a game. We have had 5 games this year were we didn't even have 25 carries.

    BTW, this is total carries, including Sproles, Tolbert, Hester, LT, and anything Rivers might pick up.

    If you look at the attempts per game, you'd think that we call plays strictly out of shotgun, and our running plays consist strictly of draws and other similar plays. But no, we're still running the ball out of the I, except we're not giving LT and the line an opportunity to wear down defenses.
     
  18. TheBeast

    TheBeast BoltTalker

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    Why don't we use any damn draws?

    So predictable.

    Norv you blow.
     
  19. SD Native WY

    SD Native WY Well-Known Member

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    Key players missing from 2007

    Tim Sullivan (Contact)

    Tuesday, November 18, 2008

    They miss Tomlinson's thundering counterpoint, Michael Turner, whose eclipsed star has risen unobscured in Atlanta. And to a larger extent than many of us may have understood, they also miss the bravura blocking of fullback Lorenzo Neal.

    “Mike (Tolbert) is a young guy, so it's hard to measure him with Lorenzo,” Tomlinson said Sunday. “Lorenzo was a 15-year guy. Mike is a 10-game guy. So, obviously, we miss (Neal's) experience ...

    “He can see sometimes the bigger picture. Meaning, if we get the ball and his man has gone away on the blitz, if he goes through the hole and sees the offensive linemen need some help, he's going to chip on (the defender). And if his man is gone, he'll get the next level. It might be a safety that I don't have to deal with. That's the kind of stuff that affects the running game.”

    There's more to it than that. Without Turner to spell him, Tomlinson's lingering toe problem had a lasting impact on the Chargers' season, which was exacerbated by Neal's absence, Tolbert's inexperience and by the inconsistent work of the offensive line.

    Yet all of those contributing factors lead to the same melancholy conclusion: that the long-standing strength of the Chargers' offense has become a deficiency.

    Concurrently, the Bolts' heretofore high-performance pass rush has deteriorated to below NFL average.

    On a per-game average, the Chargers are gaining 34.3 fewer yards on the ground and allowing 53.7 more yards in the air than they did just last season.

    An unreliable running game and an uneven pass rush is a costly combination at any level of football. At this level, for this team, it has far-reaching ripples.

    Between 2002 and 2007, the Chargers ranked among the National Football League's top 10 rushing teams six years in a row. This year, they rank 26th among the NFL's 32 teams.

    Result: The Bolts' offense doesn't do ball control and their defense can't seem to get off the field. Sunday, none of the Chargers' six first-half possessions lasted longer than six plays. Meanwhile, though the Steelers repeatedly delayed their drives with penalties, their three second-half possessions spanned 14, 10 and 13 plays.

    Through three quarters, the Steelers had bogarted the ball for 29 minutes and 16 seconds, nearly two-thirds of the total possession time. This example was extreme, but consistent with the Chargers' season-long trend line.

    “You can't really let it change your approach,” Rivers said of the possession disparity, “but it makes every play and every possession that much more precious when you may not get as many.”

    How much of this relates specifically to the loss of Merriman and the departure of Neal is highly speculative. But the Chargers are plainly a different and lesser team in their absence; a team unlikely to launch a closing rally that ends in the playoffs.

    Mike Tolbert has gears Lorenzo Neal didn't get. The undrafted rookie from Coastal Carolina is remarkably nimble by fullback standards, and a legitimate weapon as a receiver. Yet to the extent that his primary task is to clear Tomlinson's path, Tolbert's learning curve has proved to be a liability.

    “With Mike, since he's not as experienced, he focuses on his guy who he has to block,” Tomlinson said. “A lot of times, he may not see that offensive linemen need help and that's why I might get hit by a defensive lineman where Lo would have kept that guy off of me.

    “That has to do with experience again. It's tough to ask him to do that when he's just not seeing it.”

    Maybe it's coincidence, but Baltimore's running game has risen from No. 16 to No. 3 among NFL teams during Neal's first year with the Ravens. Maybe it's coincidence, but the Chargers have allowed more passing yards than any other team in the NFL since Merriman chose surgery in September.

    “It's pretty big,” Tomlinson said of Merriman's absence. “He's always been able to create pressure on the quarterback and sometimes make a play, a sack/fumble.

    “Whenever you lose him, you lose that aspect, but you also lose a body. You lose a guy you have who is the best in the league. Then you've got to fill in with the next guy and his backup, maybe a guy you get off the practice squad.”
     
  20. mrjgoo

    mrjgoo BoltTalker

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    Amen! What the hell? If they can't do simple arithmetic, get the bums out. That's why I was asking if maybe there was something I was missing there.. Seems Mega-obvious.
     
  21. wrbanwal

    wrbanwal Well-Known Member

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    I would love to watch one damn quarter without saying

    "DAMN, I SAW THAT PLAY COMING!!!"

    :tdown:
     

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